The Perfect Machine

[grendian]

In terms of a non-intel 64-bit machine designed to act as mild server for possibly dns, ftp, samba, or apache and to have the ability to dual-boot for the occasional windows game, where would one look for the best either

1)Desktop
or
2)Laptop

and would it also possibly be best to build from good parts or just a good complete system?

Thanks(if that makes sense)

[phil_patnude]

ok let me get this straight:
you want a 64bit cpu in a laptop that will run windows xp?

I wish you the best of luck my friend.
I've never seen a such thing as a laptop with a 64 bit cpu. (Wait, maybe a G4 is 64 bit???, but no PCs)
There's only 1 64bit cpu that I know windows has run on (Alpha)
Linux has been run on nearly every platform in existence, including MIPS, G4 (not sure if it is 64 bit or not...), Alpha, and even 128bit processors like Playstation2's Emotion Engine. There are distros for every one of these platforms, look around at www.linux.org or go to www.google.com/linux to start the search.

For desktops, windows NT ran on certain Compaq/DEC Alpha machines. I don't know if XP runs on newer alphas (or any alphas at all). I don't know if XP will support IA-64 yet either, but you said you're not interested in Intel chips anyway. I'm not sure if all windows software will even run on an alpha, so there's a chance you'll be out of luck with your gaming. Also, do you homework because certain DEC Alpha machines's bios will not support certain os's.

So I hope I've helped to narrow your list down slightly. And let me wish you luck again, because you will need a fair amount of work to accomplish all of your goals (if its even possible).

EDIT: By the way, the perfect machine has:
+ a well chosen new motherboard (smp is good)
+ as much ram as the motherboard can handle (ddr, depending on system architecture)
+ the fastest processor(s) it will support
+ large & fast ultra scsi hard drives (or solid-state flash memory if you can afford it) --- in a raid configuration
+ gigabit Ethernet card(s). (especially for servers)
+ A great nVidia agp graphics card with a load of video ram (think 64+ mb)
+ a fast cd or dvd burner for backups/media playing
+ an adequate power supply (400w?)
+ no irq conflicts
+ Your favorite Linux Distro with a custom-compiled kernel

[dkeav]

wait six months for prices to come down and bugs to be worked out, then build an opteron system, as stated above (especailly in the context of xp and games) a true 64 bit system is just gonna plain suck, but the opteron is a 32/64 system that is supposed to not suffer any performance losses either way, so thats the way to go

[chatins]

Non-intel 64 bit? This gives you about as many choices as Scotty Peterson has for lunch dates.

Get an intel based Dell and call it a day on the desktop side. Avoid compaq and hp on the notebook side. Don't build one unless you really know what's up.

[retoon]

Desktop, not laptop. Wait for the opteron, get a decent size hard drive. Probably gonna have to build your own system, if not, Alienware might have you covered. ($$$$$). Someone said it above. Max everything out. I have a feeling that unless this server is going to be heavy duty, you're not really going to need a 64 bit processor. (P.S. G4/3 aren't 64 bit, they are RISC in nature however. POWER Performance Optimization With Enhanced Risc:D ) If you really want great multithreading, get your hands on a nice g4 from apple. They are RISC, and are better for handling more then one function at the same time. Then toss Yellow Dog on there. There is no such thing as the perfect system, it all depends on what you're going to do with the machine. I have just one warning, no matter what, DON'T SKIMP ON THE POWER SUPPLY OR PROCESSOR COOLING SYSTEM!!! Also, if your hard drive is going to be 7200 rpm or more, get a hard drive cooler. SCSI frankly is not necessary, however, if you do want it, and have the money, wait for Ultra/Fast 5 scsi, or Ultra 640. Crazy transfer speeds (640MBper second). Also, stay away from SE signaling SCSI, stay with LVD SCSI. Only because LVD (Low Voltage Differencial) SCSI reaches further (12 meters) and has a few other features that simply have slipped my mind. Go LVD. Also, pertaning to SCSI, get adaptec, that is all. Don't worry about IRQ conflicts, they don't happen very often with PCI. No need for a custom compiled kernel, video cards are fine at 64MB, I have a hard time telling the difference between 64MB and 128 MB video cards. No need for gigabit ethernet cards, stick with 10/100.;) Good luck to you on your journey!:)

[phil_patnude]

Its not like there aren't 64 bit risc chips...

[retoon]

Oh Jeez, ofcourse there are! However, the only 64bit POWER processor was the 620, and it wasn't all that succesful. The 750, and 7400 (g3/g4) aren't 64bit. No big deal, Im just anal. :p

[phil_patnude]

thanks for clearing that up, i had thought all of the most modern ppc chips were 64 bit (g3's and g4's). i knew they were risc though

alpha, however, is both reduced instruction set & 64 bit, right?
i'm pretty certain ps2 chips are risc as well, i know the hitachi chips in dreamcasts were. (i think xbox is x86 though --32 bit cisc based on intel celrons or p3's)

[retoon]

Yep, the Alpha, later versions of MIPS and the Ultra SPARC are 64 bit implementations of RISC. I was just poking at the difference between POWER and RISC processors. :p The G4 does have a 64 bit ALU whereas the G3 had a 32 bit which took two clock cycles to perform Floating Point arithmetic.:)

[phil_patnude]

it's sad that i know this basic information (now) about which chips are risc or cisc and whether they're 32/64 bit, but i don't really understand the differences... where can i educate myself on the difference between 32 and 64 bit chips? and reduced versus complex instruction sets? any good links?

[mchangun]

is this guy saying he wants a notebook to act as a server for some of the times?!

[RWiggum]

You have very wide requirements for a computer. It sounds like you need an Opteron. I'm assuming that since it's backward-compatible with IA32 code Windows F-P will run on it. But you said "non-Intel" - do you mean not specifically made by Intel, meaning AMD is okay, or do you not want x86 architecture at all? If it's the latter, you might look at an UltraSparc like a Sun Blade 150. Debian Ultralinux runs quite well on Sparc, but you certainly aren't going to be able to use it as a Windows game machine. If you don't need the latest and greatest, Sun Ultra 5/10/60's can be had for reasonable prices on eBay.

[clim]

hey look.....you get 64 bit cpus on laptops too...


Why not get both an Opteron workstation and an Athlon 64 laptop?

Life doesn't get any better than this.

[clim]

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/0,,30_118_608,00.html

[phil_patnude]

hey look.....you get 64 bit cpus on laptops too...


Why not get both an Opteron workstation and an Athlon 64 laptop?

Life doesn't get any better than this.



apparently we will be able to get them soon, my question is "when"

can't wait

[retoon]

hey, wait for the Athlon 64 to come out. Don't get the opteron just yet. I know about its hypertransport features and all of that fun stuff, but i have a feeling that the Athlon 64, seeing as it is geared toward end users wil be better for gaming. Also, it will be less expensive. As far as references, amazon.com for books, and wikipedia.org for general information.

[FiRe_G0D]

last i heard on htis subject (coz i was lookin at getting a 64 bit comp) is that u should wait a few years till 64 bit chips come into the mainstream computing world (by that i mean wen joe bloggs goes down to dell he walks away with a 64 bit comp) because all the software needs to be ritten in 64bit otherwise they dont take full advantage of the processor, same goes with the hardware. i think it'd be pretty hard to find a decent graphics card, built for gaming, that runs on 64bit.

DONT quote me on this. this is just wot i've heard.