Why all this negative feelings for RedHat? Please explain

[bazoukas]

i can understand that with Gentoo and Slack because of the way they are build like it or not you get to learn Linux from the inside out.

But since Linux is Linux no matter what, you can go hardcore with RedHat as well. Nothing stops you.

I saw some posts here saying that they had problems with install.
I tried RH-7.1-7.2-8.0 in all three rigs of mine.
My main rig has an Abit that on the Box said it only works with Windows. Well Linux recognized everything on it.
My laptop is a Dell Inspiron 3500 and the only thing that doesnt work is the sound card.
The third one is a cheap *** Athlon, and again all went fine.
With NIC cards I dint even bother to see if they are Linux friendly. Linksys works fine.
Same goes with all my Vid Cards. a Gforce, a Revolution 9 and the Vid card of my laptop.

As for apps, frankly the only app I had to Download was MPlayer and oh the plugin for XMMS. That took just few minutes. No big deal AT ALL!
Anyway, why people are against a Distro that will help the battle with bringing Linux to the ordinary Jo smo? Suse and Mandrake does the same thing and thats good.

I dont see Gentoo or Slack being used by ordinary jo smoes who just wants his/her OS to install and just work.


Just curious guys, since I see my self as a Linux noob still.

[yinrunning]

I'm in the same boat. Haven't really figured out everything I can do with RH yet, haven't EVER recompiled a kernel. (battle for another day.), etc. Pretty noobish. But at least I feel like I can use the OS and get things done. When I'm feeling really confident about it, then I'll try something leaner and meaner. until then, I don't feel that there's anything I could do with other distros that I can't do with plain ol' RH.

[sharth]

personally, I got a smidge annoyed about the whole xmms thing. They have the rights to do that, but you have no idea how many times the same question gets asked. and the numebr of people who use a distro that helps to bring "Linux to the ordinary Jo smo", and then they find out that their mp3s don't play. I have no personal problems with them, I just thought that they should of atleast made it a bit more visable to their consumer public that they would not be supporting mp3s. Like say in the insallation somewhere. I dunno, I still go for to each their own, and I will still help out anyone using any distro that I can, but personally, red hat just isin't my cup of tea. (that and tuxracer crashed on me when I started to use it.)

[bazoukas]

By the way guys, dont take this as me flaming other Distros. Far from it.

[hlrguy]

I see people bash every distro. Who cares? I don't. I am by all means NOT a newbie, been using UNIX from the command line 13 years now, I use Redhat 8.0 (before 7.0) and love it. I installed Mandrake 8.2 on my folks/families computers. It was similar, but like you said, drop to command line and do the actual work. I will be trying Suse soon, but expect their unique GUI/Implementation, then I will drop to the command line to do remote display, ftps, etc.......

I like the look of Redhat 8.0, and honestly, if I am the only one, so what, I am the one using the computer. I have it optimized and configured. One icon, does a complete DXPC setup and remote displays the 4 GUI programs I need from work. Any distro can do that (i.e. scripts) :) The ONLY real reason for the upgrade from 7.0 was to get the truetype fonts. Everything I ever needed worked in 7.0. Pure preference and I wanted a fresh system to play with explore.

I see the GNOME/KDE thing a non issue. If you liked the old KDE, that theme is installed. I can also see that Redhat doesn't want to rock the liscence boat. I am sure it is in MS' crosshairs and MS would LOVE to be able to push MP3 owners (bride/threaten to remove support from programs) into sueing Redhat or otherwise try to cripple them. Personally, I use ogg, so it was a non issue.

hlrguy

[xulfralos]

This is clearly in the wrong forum...

[bwkaz]

Agreed. It DEFINITELY is about Linux, therefore "other Unix-based OS'es" isn't right. It's not a support question, so anywhere in Community Help probably isn't a good idea.

Which leaves the wonderful world of /dev/random. ;)

[Exodus2001]

I think some of these guys don't like the fact that a total newbie can install and use linux with little or no problems. They have been "special" for years because Linux used to be such a ***** to get working. The whole "I'm smarter than you because I use Linux" thing is dieing quickly and they are losing their little nich in the world. Most poeple that use Linux are really nice and helpful, but the few that bad mouth the easier distros are just stupid themselves. Mandrake and Red Hat are going to put Linux in the hands of everyone that wants to use Linux and they hate that.

I don't have all the time in the world so if it hadn't been for Mandrake I'd still be using Windows only. I love Slackware alot, but if it is what I had to start with I would have ran out of what little time I have and quit. There is nothing in Mandrake I can not do in Slackware. There is nothing in Slackware that I can not do in Mandrake. Linux is Linux and I have not seen any big differnece in any distro once you get it running. Open Office, Mplayer, Mozilla, etc.. all run the same in any distro I've run so I don't see a reason not to like any distro over another. Computers are nothing more than a machine that runs programs, right?

Patrick:D

[2damncommon]

I see lots of pro Red Hat posts here. If you will notice, just about every distro gets slammed sometime by someone. Rather than lumping Red Hat gripes together by quantity and asking why lots of people don't like it, read the posts that you mention and judge, ignore, or dispute their points as you feel is correct.
I bought Red Hat 7.0 that came with the broken compiler, problem with the Anaconda installer that required a patch at install time, and still wouldn't configure my i810 long after both Suse and Mandrake did. I took a look at 7.3 download edition. It doesn't offer more that I have already, so no reason to switch.
Of course if Red Hat installs well for you, it has everything you need and will generally be as good a choice as any.

[Frith]

I had an easier time compiling a kernel and upgrading software with FreeBSD than I did with RedHat. Of course, this was 3-4 years ago so RedHat may have actually improved with time (did they fix that fscking RPM system that always jacked up my box and made me swear for 40 minutes straight?).

Personally, I find Debian to be the BEST Linux distro. Not only is it extremely easy to use once you get it installed, but even the 'unstable' branch of software is actually quite stable and has rarely fscked my box up. You can also compile your own software with it, making it customizable for the novice and h4x0r.

Losers use RedHat. 31337 h4x0rZ like me use Debian, FreeBSD, or OpenBSD. You want to be like Frith, right? Right??? :confused:

[fancypiper]

I still run Redhat quite a bit (along with Mandrake and Gentoo) and it does fine.

I am a little upset at the scripts that will overwrite hand configurations in Mandrake (the worst offender) and Redhat.

I figure it can't hurt to know Redhat although I find myself in Gentoo more and more.

I use Mandrake for sound recording as I found turn-key Linux audio (http://lulu.esm.rochester.edu/kevine/turnkey/home.html), a script that installs some nice audio programs.

I use Redhat when I break something in Gentoo. I just can't leave that distro alone. You are always hearing about something and having to try it. It's the most fun distro I have found, but I think I will keep Redhat unless I become desparate for disk room.

[Dun'kalis]

I've never used Red Hat.

That said, I think they are a good company. Some people like Bluecurve, but the concept isn't sound (IMHO). You still have the differences between Qt and GTK (such as save/load dialogs), and just using the same widget set doesn't change that.

But their MP3 stance sucks...

[hlrguy]

Originally posted by Dun'kalis
I've never used Red Hat.
You still have the differences between Qt and GTK (such as save/load dialogs), and just using the same widget set doesn't change that.


I second that. There is no possible way to get my favority CD burners, Eroaster, working on based Redhat 8.0. K3b works, it is a close second, with XCDRoast for copying CDs.

Bluecurve is only one of the 8 default installed KDE themes though. So don't let that hold you back.

hlrguy

[linux12414]

I have Red Hat 7.3, and can say, I've never had any trouble with it.

It's a fine distro for a newbie, IMO since there's a graphical install (you can do it text-based as well), and lots of support.

Another poster was absolutely correct insasmuch as you can use Red Hat "hardcore" as well. Linux is linux. Yes, there's a nice graphical package manager, but you can compile and install from the command line, too. There are no restrictions. Red Hat offers the ultimate choice...hard-core use and user-friendly use. It is also my belief that if and when Linux hits desktops in industry, that desktop will most likely be Red Hat, considering their capacity for support. To the best of my knowledge, no other company offers this type of support to the customer.

While I can't speak for more recent releases, I have found 7.3 to to user friendly and rock solid.

[johnno]

I have nothing against Red Hat, or any ather distro.
Red Hat's push into the mainstream market can only benefit Linux in general, and me in particular (looking for work).
I started with Mandrake 8, then tried Red Hat 7.1, and found them both very good, and if one didn't have support for something, the other did. Debian/Knoppix was even better. The only reason I personally chose Gentoo (as a newbie - now just on 3 years total pc experience, the first two on Windows) was that I needed to learn, and learn quickly. I hate to feel like the machine's workings are magic, and it was hearing "Oh, 2000 doesn't like that" enough times, that sent me to Linux in the first place.
Also, I currently have a W2000 box on the network (the first in a year) and the machines all talk and share the web happily together. One problem - once I log into the (headless) Windows box, I can't think of a damn thing I want to do with it.
:D

[Tempus77]

Been using RH 8.0 for a few months now.......been meaning to try out other distros, but been having a blast with RH, i'm kinda reluctant to move on..........well, i guess i need to get off my butt soon and move on to the next distro down my list..........Gentoo! :D

[b0gface]

Just want to put my bit in.
I work with Solaris. I have an NT4.0 laptop supplied by work and a win 98 box at home. I had some old pc hardware laying around and I wanted to look into linux. So I looked around for a suitable distro to play with. I put red hat 8 on. I was pleased with the easy install and overall look. I think that this is a great os for people who have no *nix background. Now I am looking for something else to load onto my desktop setup for a play. I may choose suse, but will probably choose debian.
We should not knock ANY distro that make people think linux is easy to use as well as cheap. Look at how easy windoze is to run, OK, so it falls over as easily, :o , we want people to like linux don't we?
I would like my daughters school to think about linux for any new boxes thay are putting together. Open Office is a great tool, (set of tools), to further these aims. However, they MUST like the look of the desktop too.
So, don't knock a distro unless there are REAL problems. I personally think we won't get any of these, unless MSoft get involved!:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
How about it eh?

[yinrunning]

Very good points. btw, for a more *nix-y approach, Debian does rok!

[2damncommon]

We should not knock ANY distro that make people think linux is easy to use as well as cheap.
Exactly.
If a new user gets a distribution installed I would rather encourage them to learn to use that distro rather than "move on to greener pastures".
Trying other distributions makes sense. "Distro hopping" makes less.

[irlandes]

Originally posted by 2damncommon
Exactly.
If a new user gets a distribution installed I would rather encourage them to learn to use that distro rather than "move on to greener pastures".
Trying other distributions makes sense. "Distro hopping" makes less.

I sure agree with that first sentence. In my case, I was alienated by my first Redhat try, 7.3. First, it required editing a file manually to set up mount for the Win partition. There was at that time no excuse for requiring a newbie to edit files for something that basic.

Second, and more important to me since I was not a newbie, 7.3 could not control my laptop fan, which was sure a terminal problem. Laptops need some cooling once in a while.

However, my bad experiences with Redhat are not the distro, but the old hands whohave never used any other distro and seem to think anyone who uses any other distro is an idiot. We went through the same crap in 1980 with Apple v. Radio Shack. And, today as we all know, that attitude has left Apple as a barely existing company though technically their computers were always superior..

I posted on ZDNET my experience with 7.3 and my laptop, and the need to edit a file for Win partition, and a redhat user (who was a moderator) really trashed me out. Yet, my report was accurate for my computer. It was a very unpleasant experience and served no useful purpose. After all his smartalecky stuff, he finally admitted he did not edit the /etc/fstab file, he kept the file on a floppy and simply loaded it in. How many newbies will have access to that?

I sort of had the opinion that Redhat may not supply all the desktop apps of Mandrake, but that almost all versions will generally work, whereas about half Drake versions would not even run properly on my machine.

I am thinking of trying SuSe if I can get anyone who has used it on a Dell INspiron 2650 or similar machine. Mandrake seems to always include at least one booboo though they claim to do a complete beta.

[blackbelt_jones]

The more distros I try, the more Red Hat becomes my distro. It's as user-friendly as SuSE without the bloat. It takes up a lot of space on the hard drive, but it's really really stable, at least on my old box. In an unscientific test, Red Hat held a dialup connection on my desktop for about 60 hours before I finally ended the experiment. That's longer than any other OS, Linux or Windows.

Right now, my goal with Linux is to put together a desktop that will render future trips to the Windows hard drive unnecessary-- and Red Hat is taking me tantalyzingly close. My favorite windows app is a text-to-speech program called ReadPlease, and I recently discovered that Red Hat comes with text-to-speech apps (fetival and emacspeak). Still haven't gotten them working, though.

I was also annoyed at the lack of support for MP3's, but they do make a plug-in for that.

I like to think that the rivalry between the followers of different distros as essentially good natured. Am I being naive?

Finally, I am an unapologetic distro-hopper-- although that's changing. I just bought a big hard drive-- so I can fool around with different distros and still have a Red Hat installation that I mainatain over the next several months. Of course, there's stuff that you're never going to learn until you settle down, but if trying different versions of Linux is fun-- and it certainly was for me-- then why not explore the breadth of Linux before seeking to understand the depth? Installing an operating system once seemed impossibly difficult to me. Then it was exciting. Now it's getting boring, and I need to master more difficult tasks. I think the progression is healthy and natural.

[soda_popstar]

I actually quite like Red Hat. I really like Bluecurve because it is aesthetically pleasing, while providing a nice, preliminary interface unification between Qt and GTK applications. Even though I use Gentoo more, I still emerge redhat-artwork to get my Bluecurve. :) Also, I think that their implementation of Gnome is one of the best I've seen. I use Fedora Core on my desktop because I still can't get Gentoo to print to my network printer.

[sharth]

Why, oh why, was this ressurected :-p

but we all want to be like frith :p

[upheaval16]

The only thing that I can say is that hardcore linux users should know that some of the linux pro's out there would never be using linux if their were no RH to begin...

Carl

[sporkit]

Originally posted by sharth
personally, I got a smidge annoyed about the whole xmms thing. They have the rights to do that, but you have no idea how many times the same question gets asked. and the numebr of people who use a distro that helps to bring "Linux to the ordinary Jo smo", and then they find out that their mp3s don't play.

i remember ranting about that when 9 first came out. i think most people on this forum gave me some guff.

http://www.justlinux.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=551346#post551346

[happybunny]

(This is the 3rd reply with just my "2 cents")

I am totally a newbie to linux but am soaking up everything i can! I am on it all day at work and all night at home. This is how i feel:

Linux is in turmoil right now trying to break into the mainstream--yes it is mainstream for some, but not everywhere. This is not a flame at all. Again, I love it!

however, coming from a MS background and working with customers, there is yet no way they will abandon MS for linux yet. It is not going to happen. I am working it in here and there for live production (Clustered DNS, whimpy file share of some pics) and now testing Oracle apps on it. It is working its way in for sure.

It seems, however, that linux is trying to be all things to all people and it is the marketing of it that is hurting it. And I think this is where Redhat has screwed up.

Their marketing with 7, 8 then 9, but no, not 9, Fedora, no, Redhat Workstation, then the president of Redhat being quoted as saying "noone should use linux on the desktop, it is not ready yet" is what is wrong. Our biggest issue was HP/Compaq had to support a version on their hardware. They had support for 7 and 8 and promised support for 9. Then dropped that and went with SUSE for a week or so, then they came back to Redhat, but Redhat 2.1 only, not 3. And now they have support for ES 3 and SUSE 9.

If this reply seems to ramble, that is my attitude towards linux. Again, not a flame, just a comment.

I am looking for a great desktop replacement, and haven't found it yet. I have tried Redhat: to boring and like someone said, no support for MP3's?
Gentoo/slackware are hard to load (although i love a challenge).
SUSE installed good and looks nice, along with Mandrake, so I am hopeful.

But then what, KDE? Gnome? Fluxbox?

This is the greatest thing about linux, and its major downfall:

"Soo many options to pick from, great, but, man there are alot of things to pick from....never mind....ill just stick with windows" is what your average jo smo will think

Well, there it is anyway....