Linux Mandrake 9.0 blew my compuer to pieces...

[raid517]

Well ok so it didn't really... But its certainly burst a few brain cells on my part.

My problem, being an ultra newbi is associated with installing the official ATI Linux drivers for my Radeon 8500 graphics card. (see my sig for a list of relevant specs).

I managed to install the driver in non graphical mode (which I thought was reasonably neat, as i had never really used a command promt before) using the rpm -i <appname> command. When I did this I got a warning:

Warning tailored kernel module for fglrx (which I think is the driver name) not present in your system. You must go to /lib/modules/fglrx/build_mod subdirectory and execute ./make.sh to make a fully customised kernel module. Afterwards go to /lib/modules/fglrx and run run ./make_install.sh

So I do this (having finally figued out how to navigate) and run the first part of these instructions ./make.sh and I get:

Error. No kernel Module build environment.

So I ignore this seemingly obscure message and go to /lib/modules/fglrx and run .make_install.sh

When I do this I get:

Error. Kernel includes at /usr/src/linux/include not found or incomplete

file:/usr/src/linux/include/linux/version.h

So I boot to XP (since the graphical server isn't working by this time) and do a search of my Linux drive (yeah I know its neat that I can, I will explain how if anyone is interested) for a file called version.h I finally find it in a slightly different location and since in Linux Mandrake the named directories after /usr/src do not exist I create them and copy version.sh to the directory ~/include/linux

Then I reboot and Install the driver again. I repeat all the steps above until I go to ~modules/fglrx and run .make.sh

I do this and Error!

Kernel includes at /usr/src/linux/include do not match the current kernel. They are versioned as "2.4.18" instead of 2.4.19-mdksmp
You might have to adjust your symblinks:

-/usr/include
-/usr/src/linux

So I ignore this and go to the second part again L/lib/modules/fglrx and run ./make_install.sh

I do this and error:

Tailored kernel module for fglrx not present please repeat everything you just did ad infinitum. (I am of course just paraphrsing here).

So I think about what's being said (and due to some suggestions that were made here) and finally figure that since the message includes a mention of src, maybe it needs the source files to compile the new xf86config file.

So I open software manager and click on install sofware and look for any files that metion source. I find one that matches called 2.4.19.mdk (which I discover after some reading also contains the SMP version of my kernel), so I opt to install it.

Once done I check to see if it has been installed in the default location that the driver is looking in. I find the file, but not in the correct location (again slightly different) so since the required directory doesn't exist I create it and copy all of the contents of this file to the newly created directory.

Now when I look it seems that everything that is required is exactly where it should be.

So I quit x (killall kdm) and reinstall the driver with the rpm -i --force <appname> command. Things begin to look more hopeful until during the install/compiling stage I get:

2 out of 2 hunks failed - saving rejects to file drmp .h.reg
compliling 'agpgart_be.d'...
compiling 'agp3.c'...
compiling 'i7505-agp.c'...
compiling 'firegl-public.c'...

duplicating results into driver repository.

done.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ____

-creating sylink
-recreating module dependancy list
-trying a sample load of the kernel module

Warning: Loading /lib/modules/2.4.19-16mdksmp/kernel/drivers/char/drm/fglx.o will taint the kernel: non-GPL licence

-Propretory. (C) 2002 - ATI technologies, Starnberg, Germany.

See http://www.tux.org/lkml/#export-tainted for information about tainted modules.

Module fglrx loaded with warnings.

So I try startx and... Nothing error meaage:

No screens found.

Still at least its not complaining any more about not finding files.

So what to do next I wonder?

Q

[raid517]

Bump...! Oh come on guys.... I thought there was supposed to be some real experts round here? This is noobie help isn't it? :) I've tried for days to work this out - surely someone must know something that could help?

I thought this site was the answer to my dreams when I found it. Maybe I was mistaken...

Q

[fancypiper]

This board is run by volunteers and 27 hours isn't very long to wait on free help, is it? Patience is a needed virtue for using Linux. :p

If you have Midnight Commander installed, the command line may seem simpler. Try commanding mc and see if it runs.

Read the README and INSTALL files carefully when installing something, it usually has what you have overlooked in those files

Possible trouble:
1. Do you have your kernel source and headers installed?

Mandrake links:
Mandrake Users (http://www.mandrakeuser.org/) website
Easy software management: urpmi (http://www.linux.org/apps/AppId_2189.html) - Red Carpet (http://www.ximian.com/products/ximian_red_carpet/)

[Tiomera]

There are a lot of good people around here. There offered lots of help to me.
Ok, from the minimal experience I have :) I have little to say to you.
Have you compiled a new kernel? Are you sure you can add modules to it(you compiled this feature with it)?
SomeWhere in you file you say the libraries have different kernel versions 2.4.18 instead of 2.4.19. Maybe you have the wrong package.
This is as far as precise knowledge goes, anything else would be too much of a guess, LOL

[bwkaz]

Well, not all of us are paid to help anyone (actually, I don't believe anyone here is...), so it is therefore true that some people do not read the boards between 10:30 pm and 1:30 pm the next day. Myself, for example.

Anyway, I don't have any experience with ATI's drivers. It seems that they are a little similar to nVidia's, though, in that they need a proper kernel module working in order to do AGP, 3D, etc.

I think the biggest problem is right here:

Error. No kernel Module build environment.

So I ignore this Do not ignore error messages (warnings are something else, though). Errors are printed to prevent you from shooting yourself in the foot later, and ignoring them is a good way to, well, shoot yourself in the foot. The biggest problem here seems to be that you don't have a proper kernel source directory, which is necessary when building kernel modules. The kernel source directory, /usr/src/linux, should also be configured properly for the kernel that you will use to insert the driver later (the one you'll be running later). You should finally be running the same kernel when you do the installation as you will be when you will be running the driver later (but I don't think that last part is a problem here).

For Mandrake, I think what you'll really need is to first, figure out what uname -r tells you. This will be the current kernel. Then, find a kernel-source-<that version> RPM package on your Mandrake CDs, delete whatever's at /usr/src/linux and below it, and then install the RPM (with Mandrake's rpmdrake / Software Manager app, for example). This should create a /usr/src/linux-2.4.19-<some other stuff>. So cd into /usr/src and run a ln -sf linux-2.4.19-<whatever else> linux to create the /usr/src/linux symlink. Then, go back to the /lib/modules/fglrx/build_mod directory, and do a make clean, then rerun the make.sh script. If that fails, STOP and post the make.log file.

[raid517]

Ok well thanks. 27 hours may not seem long to you, but when youve been going at this for 3 days or more is sure seems long.

Anyway thanks for the input.

If you have Midnight Commander installed, the command line may seem simpler. Try commanding mc and see if it runs.

No I don't think I have that installed.

Read the README and INSTALL files carefully when installing something, it usually has what you have overlooked in those files

Thanks for the helpful hint. But I have read all the helpfiles I could find about this, indeed I read and read until all I can see now when I close my eyes and try to sleep are lines and lines of seemingly hieroglyphic code and text and when I sleep I have strange dreams about having finally worked this out, only to wake dissapointed to find I have not.

Possible trouble: 1. Do you have your kernel source and headers installed?

I wouldn't know that. How would I determine if they were installed? And how would I place them in the correct location so that the ATI configuration utility can find them?

As for comiling a new kernel, I wouldn't know where to start. I have to say it sounds a very complex process. What does this entail and how would I go about it?

Also is none of what I wrote above of meaning to anyone? What I wrote is an exact reporoduction of the process I went through, so maybe someone will be able to see where i went wrong or what I should be doing.

Again thanks for the input. I am grateful (as I indicated in my original post) for any information/assistance anyone can offer on this. I'm sure someone somewhere must have had experience of installing this driver on an SMP system running Mandrakke 9.0
So far the number of people I have encountered who have done this seems to be very small... (Well, really there doesn't seem to have been any so far).

Regards,

Q :)

[raid517]

Mmm let me clear this up, I at no time ever complained about getting no help. All I did was bump the thread up to the top of the list again as it was in danger of languishing and dropping off the front page. I said in my original mail I would be grateful for any help anyone can offer. But just because some guy makes a crack about not being paid everyone pipes in and attempts to make me feel that I'm being ungrateful or something. I'm not. I know no one gets paid here. I help out on enough forums of my own to know that there is often little reward or thanks for offering someone help, but I like you still do it. So please enough of the "I don't get paid cracks", I know that, I am grateful for your help - and if you did work here I would even be happy to pay you for your time.

Hopefully we can get on with the technical aspects of this now? :)

Once more let me make it clear I would be grateful, would appreciate etc. any help any one can offer on this. It is something that (with whatever help I can get) I am determined to resolve.

Regards,

Q

[fancypiper]

Midnight Commander (http://www.ibiblio.org/mc/)

Perhaps these will help.

Guides to software and installation:
Compiling Kernels NHF (http://linuxnewbie.org/nhf/Compiling_Kernels/)
LNAG - How do I install a program I downloaded from the Internet? (http://sunsite.dk/linux-newbie/lnag_basics.html#how_do_install)
Rute Guide's software explanation (http://rute.2038bug.com/node27.html.gz)

[raid517]

Well everything helps really... I will look at this carefully. Any other info, particularly if you have experience with this driver/Linux version would be very welcome.

Q :)

[carlywarly]

To install your kernel source - open Mandrake Control Centre - Software - Install Software - choose alphabetical all packages - then scroll down for kernel* and find either kernel-headers or kernel source. Select them and install the packages. That should help with your error messages.

PS - in future, when you do an install, choose all the development packages. Usually, you will need them at some point.

[raid517]

Thank you I will give that a go. :)

Q

[bwkaz]

Umm...

....

Hello?

Originally posted by bwkaz
For Mandrake, I think what you'll really need is to first, figure out what uname -r tells you. This will be the current kernel. Then, find a kernel-source-<that version> RPM package on your Mandrake CDs, delete whatever's at /usr/src/linux and below it, and then install the RPM (with Mandrake's rpmdrake / Software Manager app, for example). This should create a /usr/src/linux-2.4.19-<some other stuff>. So cd into /usr/src and run a ln -sf linux-2.4.19-<whatever else> linux to create the /usr/src/linux symlink. Then, go back to the /lib/modules/fglrx/build_mod directory, and do a make clean, then rerun the make.sh script. If that fails, STOP and post the make.log file. Would you mind trying that? Thanks.

(and it wasn't 27 hours, that would be understandable... it was 10:30 pm yesterday->1:30 pm today, which is 8 hours while I, personally, was sleeping, then 7 hours while I was at class and reading the other boards here. 15 hours, not 27...)

[mdwatts]

And I was at work yesterday (OT) at 6:30 a.m., worked nearly 8 hours (non-stop), answered a few questions here when I got home and then back at work this morning at 7 a.m. (again non-stop). Plus I had to work last Friday (my flex day off).

I do not usually spend time here at LNO while at work since my company pays me to do their work and not LNO's.

Plus I need to sleep, cook, eat, housework etc. etc...

I still however manage to put in around 45-50 hours at LNO, BUT still cannot keep up with the amount of questions being posted. That would be a 24/7 job. If LNO paid me (at all/enough) I would quit my job and work here fulltime. That won't happen.

[raid517]

Damn guys what do I have to say to convince you? No one is faulting what you do. This seems to be a popular linux joke, 'I don't get paid for what I do so you should be totally damn grateful that I even take the time to spit in your direction.' I've seen the line before used with others on Linux forums, although strangely it is a line that is only ever really used almost exclusively on Linux forums. No one else on other forums (including myself when I help out) seems all that stressed about not being paid. Its supposed to be a voluntary thing you do because you like helping people. If you want payment you should set up a payment regime or something, or if I can get my little issue worked out maybe I'll look into making a contribution. But this 'I'm not being paid' line is starting to wear a bit thin. I said I was grateful, I wrote a long post explaining just how grateful I was but I don't get why I have to keep reminding you and saying thanks, good job, much appreciated etc. Its good to help people - and its nice if they say thanks, but you shouldn't expect them to kiss your *** every time you say something that is potentially helpful.
This is already stressful enough without having to worry that if something goes wrong I'm going to have to come back here groveling on my knees just to ask for help again. So can I just say thanks and leave it at that? It seems to be good enough in most other places.

Q

[raid517]

As for the technical aspects of my problem (which are the only really relevant aspects here) I haven't had time to look at all the advice that was given yet. I did the RPM install thing - and I found an RPM that was called src but it was for 2.4.19-mdk and not 2.4.19-mdksmp Moreover it did not install this module to the default directory in which the ATI driver is looking for it (See above). Although I will repeat the install process again, I am quite sure of what the likely results will be. I think whats being asked for is the source for my smp kernel. The problem is I can't find/don't have the source for my smp kernel on any of the three cds I have (I have looked btw).
So the problem is (or seems to be) how to get the source to the the correct default directory so that the ATI driver can find it. That is if I have understood most of what's been said here. So if anyone has any other suggestions on how I might do this please feel free to let me know.
Again I would like to thank everyone for their help, although I trust that this can now be taken as read. What is of primary interest to me here is the technical aspects of this problem. I hope that we can focus on this - and not be sidetracked by individual, personal, or critical concerns. Computers are after all machines - and thus it is perhaps wise to approach them in as cool and logical a manner as possible. :)

Regards,

Q

[fancypiper]

An rpm that's src is the source code in rpm form, so it's handled differently than a binary rpm.

See Maximum RPM (http://www.rpm.org/max-rpm/)for full details.

Instead of a full re-install, you could select upgrade and expert mode (whatever the 'dreke install calls it) and select kernel, kernel headers and developmental packages.

That's much faster and ends up being the same.

You learn more by fixing rather than re-installing. The instinct to re-install comes from your experiences with Windows.

Mindset: switch ms->linux

[JohnT]

I gave up trying to configure my ATI, as it's been one of the more problematic until this new kernel. I got a cheap nvidia. Cheap because I looked at the supported cards and chose one that was older than the XF86 version. It's difficult to support tomorrows cards with today's version.
As to the attitude here, it wasn't the topic of pay that set it off, rather your post (second) that seemed to set the tone.


B]Bump...! Oh come on guys.... I thought there was supposed to be some real experts round here? This is noobie help isn't it? I've tried for days to work this out - surely someone must know something that could help?

I thought this site was the answer to my dreams when I found it. Maybe I was mistaken...

[/B]

[raid517]

Originally posted by bwkaz
For Mandrake, I think what you'll really need is to first, figure out what uname -r tells you. This will be the current kernel. Then, find a kernel-source-<that version> RPM package on your Mandrake CDs, delete whatever's at /usr/src/linux and below it, and then install the RPM (with Mandrake's rpmdrake / Software Manager app, for example). This should create a /usr/src/linux-2.4.19-<some other stuff>. So cd into /usr/src and run a ln -sf linux-2.4.19-<whatever else> linux to create the /usr/src/linux symlink. Then, go back to the /lib/modules/fglrx/build_mod directory, and do a make clean, then rerun the make.sh script. If that fails, STOP and post the make.log file.

Sorry I'm just getting through what everyone has said. At the default directory that you suggested: file:/usr/src/linux there is indeed a file called linux-2.4.19-16mdk but as was stated above theATI driver is looking for a file called linux-2.4.19-16mdksmp futher it is looking for it in a (as yet) non existant directory eg usr/src/linux/include Moreover, as I said I dont seem able to locate the source file for 2.4.19-mdksmp

A potential clue (though not a resultion to the missing file) might be the other part of the message above:

"You might have to adjust your symlinks"

-/usr/include
-/usr/src/linux

I'm not sure what this means, other than perhaps its saying that I should ajust the driver information about which directory to look in. But again this is a wild stab in the dark.

Well I hope this make sense to you anyway.

Thanks for your input.

Q

[fancypiper]

smp is for dual cpus and you are running linux-2.4.19-16mdk, si I think your box has only one cpu. I think you grabbed the wrong file.

Get the one that matches linux-2.4.19-16mdk

[raid517]

Mmm, I don't know about the 'tone' of my second post, or any of my posts. A technical query shouldn't be taken as containing any paricular tone. Nonetheless it was intended as a simple humorous reminder that I was still here. It like the (humorous) title of the thread, is meant purely in good fun - and to stop the subject dropping to the second page - and thereby to almost certain obscurity. However (perhaps due to the long hours people spend here, while holding down full time jobs too) it seems that humour is in rather short supply. This does not concern me greatly, as my single motivating interest is in addressing the issue at hand. All else is (or should be) irrelevant.
However no matter how many times I have said thank you now, it seems this has escalated and now certain folks appear to think I'm a nasty ungrateful swine, who doesn't know when to be grateful for good advice. I'm not sure where this idea crept in, or why it even exists. As far as gratitude goes I am not sure what more I am expected to do to prove my gratitude. I feel almost as if I am being asked to crawl on my belly in order to obtain an answer for what should be a relatively simple question, which is completely unfair. As thankful as I am for any help I get, I'm not certain either that it is something I am prepared to do. As I said on other forums one thankyou is normally enough. I don't undertand why here one needs to be profuse in their appreciation of the efforts of fellow posters. To write a Hollywood type speech of appreciation with every question is to say the least likely to become very tiresome.
If we could all just be adults and address the issues, I'm sure everone would get along a lot better. :)

Q

[raid517]

Originally posted by fancypiper
smp is for dual cpus and you are running linux-2.4.19-16mdk, si I think your box has only one cpu. I think you grabbed the wrong file.

Get the one that matches linux-2.4.19-16mdk

Have a look at my signature. I think you will see that I do have dual (2x) cpus the file I am missing is the source file for linux-2.4.19-16mdksmp (SMP being the multiprocessor module).

I have searched all my CDs for this and google too. But have been unable to locate anything that matches it. If anyone can find this. Please let me know.

:)

[fancypiper]

:D

<humor>You seem to have thin skin. Linux geeks have thick skins.

You seem upset Has Windows lost all your information again? I feel your pain as it happend to me 3 times.

Just read all the man pages for commands starting with a unitl you can relax....

Alphabetical Directory of Linux Commands (http://www.onlamp.com/linux/cmd/)</humor>
:D

[raid517]

Mmm... Strange humour...I think there was more than me getting upset here. (Not that I was ever that upset - I just couldn't understand why people were going on about not being paid. I mean, not many people get paid to write on forums) but oh well, that page is extremely helpful. :) BTW does anybody actually know and good Linux geek jokes? I'm heard one or two, but I daren't repeat them here as possibly someone would be offended. :D

Regards,

Q

Ps

You seem upset Has Windows lost all your information again?

Erm... No I have never lost data, well not through anything that wasn't my own fault. Windows and Linux are both pretty stable these days - so data loss isn't really a big factor.

[raid517]

Mmm then again if a Linux geek told a joke would anybody understand it? No doubt the punch line would probably be in binary.... :D

Q

[raid517]

Question:

Why did the chicken cross the road?

Answer:

101111001110011101

:D

[fancypiper]

Originally posted by raid517
Mmm then again if a Linux geek told a joke would anybody understand it? No doubt the punch line would probably be in binary.... :D

Q I let Linux tell me jokes.

Type these commands:

^Can Windows replace Linux?

%blow

PATH=pretending! /usr/bin/which sense

[raid517]

Lol. :D Well Linux certainly doesn't seem sure of its own future.... :D

Q

PS,

I guess I'm going to probably just have to give up on finding this smp kernel file. I think maybe some of these guys are a bit miffed at me (over what I still don't know). But if anybody can stay calm and let me know where to find this file please let me know.

[fancypiper]

Originally posted by raid517
Lol. :D Well Linux certainly doesn't seem sure of its own future.... :D:confused: Did you read it right?]My system said: $ ^Can Windows replace Linux?
bash: :s^Can Windows replace Linux? : substitution failedIt sounds like Windows is a bad substitute for Linux to me. :confused:

Your best bet might be the Mandrake Cooker (http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/cookerdevel.php3). Did you search it or ask their discussion forum (http://www.mandrakeclub.com/modules.php?name=Splatt_Forum) for help?

[raid517]

Mmm maybe I typed it the wrong way round... Force of habit perhaps. Anyhoo, take a look at my initial post for an update of my efforts. I seem to have solved some problems, only to create new ones... :)

Q

[JohnT]

http://rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/cooker/boot_Tree.html

[mdwatts]

Since you are the owner of this thread and have the access rights, why not just delete this thread entirely and repost the question again?

Start fresh...

[fancypiper]

Configuring x:
Linux Hardware Compatibility HOWTO (http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Hardware-HOWTO/)
The Linux XFree86 HOWTO (http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/XFree86-HOWTO/)
Common x configuring tools:
Redhat - setup utility leads to several config tools
Redhat 8.0 - redhat-config-xfree86
Debian - dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
You may have these tools:
XF86Setup
XFree86 -configure
Xconfigurator
xf86cfg
xf86config
xconf

[bwkaz]

The other thing is, that Mandrake (and a lot of other distros) name their kernel versions by what they're configured to do, not by which version they are. In this case, the difference between SMP and non-SMP is not a matter of a different kernel, just different configuration parameters.

In your /boot directory, is there something resembling a config file, perhaps named config-2.4.19-16mdksmp? If it's there, then copy it to /usr/src/linux/.config, maybe that will help. Run the "make mrproper oldconfig dep" after copying it, and then retry the ATI driver.

There should be a kernel config file somewhere on your system that will have the proper information in it... whether that's in /usr/src/linux, or in /boot, or somewhere else...

Actually, you could try a find / -name '{.c,c}onfig*' as root, and wait forever until it finishes searching all your hard drives that are currently mounted, to see if such a config file exists anywhere. There will probably be one in /usr/src/linux-2.4.19-16mdk, but that one most likely isn't right (though it might be)...

Otherwise, you can always pull down the 2.4.20 kernel from www.kernel.org and configure, compile, and install it yourself. That way, the source directory will have to match the running kernel...

You'll have to start over on the ATI driver if you do that, though. You'll also want to read all the help on all the kernel options (personally, I'd recommend menuconfig when it comes time to decide which configuration method to use, but use whatever you want) during configuration, to make sure you select stuff that will work with your system. There are also HOWTO's at www.tldp.org and NHF's here on the subject.

One other thing about that -- Mandrake likes modules. And it likes to, instead of using the kernel utilities to load them, load them manually. Which means you could get a lot of "module not found" messages when you reboot into the new kernel the first time -- if you do, then note what is being started at the time, and reconfigure the kernel to make that a module. Recompile, re-install it, and reboot into the new one again. Keep doing this until your bootscripts work.

[raid517]

Mmm I'm not sure about starting from scratch again. I made some progress - and as such I would very much appreciate if some of you would look at my edited inital post again - and read about the outcome of my latest efforts.
I am no longer missing the kernel source modules as the original kernel source module contained the source for both single processor and SMP versions. But other problems have (Inevitably) emerged.

As for deleting this thread, well depite some misunderstandings, and some people not having much of a sense of humour and needing an awful lot of reassuring that their efforts were appreciated, there is still some useful information here that I and others could refer to. However as you recommend a fresh start I will repost my original question and attempt to focus attention purely on the relevant issues, as there has been the odd ocassion when this thread has strayed somewhat from the point. At least if this thread does drop off the page, some of the information it contains will still be available to other newbies should they need it.

In any case thanks for the helpful suggestion. I feel I may not be too far away from a resolution, so if anyone would care to read my new edited post I would very much appreciate your views on what I might try next.

Regards,

Q :)