http://www.linuxnewbie.org/articles/jrigby.html

[quickfoot]

I respectfully submit that if you simply want a program to launch when you click its icon and want to add and remove programs such as in Windows that you run windows.

Linux is not designed to be windows, it is designed for the power user or the user willing to use something new.

A major part of linux is the shell and it is a very powerful and productive tool, more powerful than any gui interface will ever be.

I find some of the statistics that you list in the arcticle to be highly unlikely. If you could provide me with the source of the information for your statistics I would appreciate it.

Linux is not an os you can simply jump from windows to. It is easy to install and get working once you take the time to understand it.

If you truly do not want to learn an os as it is then stay with the os you currently have.

2000 and NT are both very stable and would offer you the things you seem to desire.

Linux is not for everyone and please don't make unbelievable assumptions about the Linux community such as 99% of the people who run Linux will never want to see the shell.

Thank you,

with respect

Quickfoot

[Crackmaster]

Hear, hear. I agree wholeheartedly. I saw someone on this very board post an interesting anecdote a while back (sorry, I forgot who), and within that post found a quote that fits this situation perfectly: "Linux is user-friendly. It's just not idiot-friendly." Don't wanna deal with a CLI (we all know they're SO hard to use) or any system configuration, and have the OS hold your hand through every step? That's what Windows and the Mac OS are for. Sure, it might be nice to have a few sugar-coated Linux distros, but you can't complain about the lack of them at the moment. The OS simply isn't intended to be Windows. I was a newbie a few months ago (I suppose some might still call me one), but going into it, I knew what to expect. That's the biggest reason the (vast) majority of people switch from Windows to Linux: They're tired of being treated like babies. And maybe it's just me, but I can't imagine anyone having install troubles with MDK 7.2. I actually have a few friends who went right to it from Windows without a problem. Bottom line: Linux is an "engine-room" OS. Take it or leave it.

------------------
"It takes more than a turtleneck to look like a chihuahua." -Dogbert

[harlequin]

Well, my two young respondents both missed the point - precisely.
While nobody would normally take such statistics TOO seriously, rather like the nonsensical claims of PC - much less Internet penetration - into homes, the true figures would not be out by any real extreme.

The people who really LIKE/WANT/MUST pull their autos apart and change their own oil would be a fair comparison to those who simply call in to their friendly trained mechanic. less than one in a 100,000.

My point was: To have any system seriously challenge Big Bill was that it would have to be non-geek usable - exactly as Windows 98 turned out to be.

The insulting attitudes evidenced in your non-thought-through responses demonstrates the exact point made in my short piece:

Whilever the notion persists that there is something "macho" in re-inventing the wheel every time you turn a box on, Bill will rule. Period.

I was young once too, a century or so ago and liked doing things the Hard(macho) Way, but then even females learned to do most things and what is so impressive about Skydiving, flying a Fighter, stomping along a Command Line, when even SHE can do it........ ( stop don't shoot! I'm only making a point, here :-) )

Microsoft has a stranglehold on the future of the PC User for as long as it is a monopoly. It will remain vastly over-priced and underperforming.
Linux - thanks to GNU, has opened vast possibilities, not the least of which is a truly useable and COMPETITIVELY economical alternative.
Mandrake and RedHat both have gigantic potential to take advantage of the enormous pent-up frustration of over 100 MILLION USERS, not just 100,000 geeks, to give them a SIMPLE, USER-oriented Distribution such as I have described in the Mandrake Newbie List..........
AND become very wealthy by Doing The Right Thing.

[quickfoot]

You made no points against Linux or Unix for that manner, only supporting my claim that you should stick with the operating system that best meets your wants, in this case Windows.

I am not young and resent your assumption of age, the fact that you are unable to backup your claims of the amount of Unix/Linux users not wanting to use the control prompt further supports our claims.

I am sorry you have not yet been able to make it through the simple process of installing mandrake (it takes about 10 presses of enter) however based on your requirements for an OS I would recommend windows 2000 (I am a MCSE and according to Microsoft it is the end all OS http://www.linuxnewbie.org/ubb/smile.gif

You are not the type of person who should use an operating system that requires you to be able to learn new things.

You are stuck in the Microsoft way of doing things and that is the first thing you should ditch when switching to a Unix OS.

If you are unable or unwilling to do this then please by all means stick with Windows.

DO NOT try to turn Linux into windows, it isn't designed to be and it never will be (thankfully)

It is not for someone who wants the os to do everything for them and doesn't want to have a clue about what is going on.

Please refrain from making personal attacks and have some actual data worth reading in your next paper.

Thanks.

[harlequin]

My points stand.
If you are not very young, I am surprised. :-)
However, I have had a 27 y.o. tell me how "he gave his whole working life to the &%^#$ Company" that fired him and took away his Bimmer. In a sense, he was right. He was all of 27 and been at that company his whole working life of 3 years.............

NOW to your "response?"
QUOTE:
You made no points against Linux or Unix for that manner, only supporting my claim that you should stick with the operating system that best meets your wants, in this case Windows.
ENDQUOTE
This is not germaine to anything I said in *any* post. ???
QUOTE:
I am not young and resent your assumption of age, the fact that you are unable to backup your claims of the amount of Unix/Linux users not wanting to use the control prompt further supports our claims.
ENDQUOTE
Whether I assumed youth based on your reply has nothing to do with "further supporting your claims".
Again, not logical, not germaine.

QUOTE: I am sorry you have not yet been able to make it through the simple process of installing mandrake (it takes about 10 presses of enter)
ENDQUOTE
You have obviously not done it. No experience of the GUI install is evidenced here by you. It is not yet a simple process.
Go and read the support Email Lists!!

I am trying to shepherd a large group of Windows-oriented-Windows-hating people toward the Light.

But the 5th iteration of Linux tested has just failed to install on any of my machines without major problems.
I alternate between each of the major new releases that come out and optimistically try them.

QUOTE:
however based on your requirements for an OS I would recommend windows 2000 (I am a MCSE and according to Microsoft it is the end all OS
ENDQUOTE
Hint: In the REAL Trade you do not tell people you are a Microsoft "Mouse" as they are called. :-)
ONLY a MSCE would suggest NT for *anything*.
One of my ex-employees ( I owned a WAN company for 18 years ) took my advice and went for MS Certification and to stay away from Unix/Novell for the simple reason that Unix is stable, anyone can run Novell, and NT will never be stable for 2 reasons.
THe MONEY is in MS. It is a negative product for users, a goldmine for sellers and even better for Supporters.
Learned something new today??? :-)

QUOTE
You are not the type of person who should use an operating system that requires you to be able to learn new things.
ENDQUOTE
I am still fairly certain from your writing style that I was fighting with FORTRAN before you were born..... But , just because I KNOW how to clean latrines, is no reason to continue doing it...

QUOTE
You are stuck in the Microsoft way of doing things and that is the first thing you should ditch when switching to a Unix OS.
ENDQUOTE
Unix is not Linux. The Trade distinction is fairly clear. I like Unix. It is just too expensive for Linus and me.
Products like Mandrake *could* be the future, but not while it is kept in the dark for the tiny few who like it that way.
I believe that with people like me nudging it in the right direction, it will become a real People's Communication System and not remain a novelty Nerd's entertainment.

QUOTE
It is not for someone who wants the os to do everything for them and doesn't want to have a clue about what is going on.
Please refrain from making personal attacks and have some actual data worth reading in your next paper.
ENDQUOTE
NOT TRUE. It certainly will be something that does what I want it to do. Not immediately, while people still have attitudes like yours, but as the gospel spreads, it will.
There is a fortune awaiting the first company that realises that SIMPLICITY and GENUINE PRODUCTIVITY is what it is all about for the tens of millions of trapped, frustrated Windoze Users.
Mandrake et al are only the beginning.
Just what do you think is driving the growth?
Just what do you think is holding it back?

Finally and in finale:
I do not make personal attacks. They were made on me. Go read what you two wrote....
THEN go read what I wrote.
As for data:
"The first refuge of the inept, the insecure and the politician is always to Reports and Statistics, for all else requires reason and its implication of needful intelligence"
Li Pi Tze
First, THINK about the information presented, consider the proposition, then decide to investigate or not.

Are you SERIOUSLY suggesting for even a nanosecond that my general assertions of comparative numbers are wrong?

Go in peace and sin no more..... :-)