Learning Linux

[rmart0729]

Hello,

I want to learn Limux. I'm a desktop support technician at a college so the good news is I know the basics of computers and I know Windows OS. If my boss tells me to hook up a new computer to our network and install a new piece of hardware and map the computer to a network drive I can do all of that in Windows without thinking. I can troubleshoot and fix software and hardware problems in Windows like it is second nature. My goal is to be able to do everything I can in Windows as a user and fixing the computer, in Linux.

I know you must learn to stand before you can learn to walk and so on, but I have no clue where to start. I work best with step by step instructions and my problem is I want to learn and know things right away. I went to http://www.linux.org/lessons/beginner/index.html and followed the courses using an extra Dell I have in my office. I only got to installing Debian and then quit because the computer booted into X-Windows but the lessons talked about command lines and didn't even cover X-Windows until near the end. This approach didn't work for me and there are so many distributions of Linux and different GUI interfaces I'm not sure where to begin, any suggestions?

Thanks

[psych-major]

Here are several things to consider:

If you want to pick up where you left off with Debian, you can get to a console any time by pressing CTL+ALT+F2, F3, etc
To get back to the desktop environment, press ALT+F7
If you want a setup that is very similar to Windows, with easy installation, try Ubuntu or SuSE. Once it's fully installed, then you can mess around with learning.
If you really want to learn as you go, and understand why certain things are happening, you might go with Slackware. It is well documented on the Slackware site, and here on JL.

Hope this helps!

[dkeav]

you wanna learn linux? take everything you learned from using windows and forget it, start from there

[rmart0729]

you wanna learn linux? take everything you learned from using windows and forget it, start from there

Hello,

I work on Windows computers daily, I'm thinking forgetting everything I learned from Windows would be a bad thing. Any other suggestions? My boss isn't a big supporter of Linux, but I still want to learn it for myself.

Thanks

[dkeav]

the idea, is forget all those bad habits you have learned and probably false or incorrect logic, do that and wrapping your mind around things in a unix environment becomes much easier

you boss doesnt like linux because he would have to put forth effort to learn anything about it and in the off chance he cant, then his ability to fullfill his job comes into question, your boss doesnt like linux because hes scared of losing his job, is ignorant on the subject or maybe hes just lazy

[irlandes]

A lot of people have problems with Linux because they are constantly comparing to Windows, or trying to do stuff the way they know. Though dkeav is perhaps a bit strong, I suspect that is what he is trying to let you know. (Apologies, Dkeav, if I misunderstand you.)

Go to any large chain bookstore and look for Linux training books.

Or, download or buy a live CD. Everyone instantly thinks of Knoppix, which started the Linux Live CD craze. Bad idea. Knoppix people are really ornery to anyone who actually tries to install Knoppix, though it comes with an installer. Other versions, such as Ubuntu or Kubuntu will let you play a lot without installing, yet it should install when you want it to.

There are a number of places which sell CD's for distros if you have problems downloading and/or burning CD's. I use www.cheapbytes.com though it is only one of many.

Right here on Justlinux.com, if you dig for postings by Blackbelt_jones, he has not only referenced some good stuff, but I believe he has actually produced some of his own training stuff. When he first came on here, he was sort of a pain in the chair, but he has come a long ways!!! He seems to remember how hard it was as a newbie, which is a real good skill to have.

Google for linux tutor beginner or something like that. In the past there has been a lot of free stuff.

http://heather.cs.ucdavis.edu/~matloff/Linux/LinuxInstall.pdf

http://www.penguintutor.com/tutorials/viewdoc.php?doc=command-basics-reference

http://linuxreviews.org/beginner/

http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/8699

http://www.justlinux.com/nhf/

Redhat EL costs a lot of money. CentOs is a clone, but we cannot say it is Redhat, that is part of the rules. CentOs has a very large amount of docs available.

[Sepero]

Dkeav means, just because you might be a Guru at MSwindows, that doesn't mean jack squat when it comes to Linux. Example: A common idea to solve program problems in MS is program reinstall. In Linux, I have had a program reinstall fix only one problem in 4 years of using Linux.

If you really want to learn Linux, Yes, do learn the commandline. Once the commandline is understood, you can take that knowledge to just about any distribution. GUI's will be different, commandline will be the same.

[irlandes]

of how people interpret the same things in a different way. To me, you and I said essentially the same thing but in a different way. To you, it seems they were totally different things.

"Users" can do most everything without using the command line, OP. But, it is true, within your statement of what you want to learn, command line is really mandatory at your level of technical knowledge.

Here is a trick which may or may not interest you. Open a terminal prompt, of any kind, in Gnome or Kde, or in runlevel 3 (no GUI). Type a letter, any letter, then hit TAB. On my distro, you hit TAB once, on older versions, you hit it twice. It will display all the commands which start with that letter.

To learn about a command, then clear the original letter, and type:

man <command of your choice> <enter>

Not all commands have man pages, but many do and they are your source of details on that command.

Or, with no letter, hit TAB twice, and tell it, yes, you want all commands, which will give you the number of commands, as well as over-filling the window with commands. There are a great number of them.

Trust me, it is going to take time and patience. Don't get in a rush, and don't give up. if you tire, put it aside, and come back to it later.

The thing about Linux, as different from Windows as it is, almost everything you learn is going to last a very long time. Some of the first things I learned way back in 1999 are just as useful today as they were then.

Some people make a text file with any word processor or text editor, and when they learn a command with its options, they type that into the file, especially if it is a complex command, so they don't have to figure it out every time.

http://www.justlinux.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=142980 is one of BlackBelt Jones efforts to help the newbies. He said it is a stickie, but I didn't notice on which forum.

[wetsax]

There is a good book by Mark Minasi for Windows Admins who are trying to learn Linux.
http://www.amazon.com/Windows-Administrators-Minasi-Administrator-Library/dp/0782141196

I hope that helps.

[rmart0729]

Hello,

Thanks for all the posts. Well, after talking more to my boss I found out that she does know a little bit about Linux but won't be sending me to training but encouraged me to learn on my own and gave me permission to do so in my spare time here at work.

I read the post by blackbelt_jones which helped and I also took a test that was in that post at: http://www.zegeniestudios.net/ldc/index.php The test recommeded Mandrake. Also many people say the Gnome GUI is a preference. My boss also said to learn the Linux command line.

I know how to partition for a Linux/Windows dual boot computer and I found a truly non-destructive Linux based tool called GPARTED. I love it and in messing around I have learned how to resize my Windows computer for Linux, although I won't actually do this until I feel comfortable that I can USE and TROUBLESHOOT Linux as well as I can Windows. I'd really love to learn Liux as I go rather than just "jumping in" I'd like to understand what I'm doing. Any further suggestions would be helpful.

Any opinions on Mandrake as a starter or Slackware was another mentioned to me. Being that I want to learn Linux and understand it step by step is that even possible? If I have to go buy a book I will although I'd prefer not having to. Any thoughts?

Thanks

[infiniphunk]

hey friend I just took that Distro chooser test and it told me to use Gentoo, which I have tried once to install. Personally, I got started on Mandrake (when it was still called that) and would have to say there are certainly better distros out there for a new user. But I'm going to have to side up with Slackware for sure, I've used it lots in the past and have liked it all along. Now I mostly use Zenwalk (which is based on slack) and really like it. They also make an amazing liveCD called Zenlive, which I have to say is rather incredible. Ubuntu also a pretty good place to start; great community online to help you, impressive liveCD and all around easy to use. You'll probably find it easier to use than Windows in no time. You'll see!

Cheers and good luck!

[michux]

Hello,

I want to learn Limux. [...] I know you must learn to stand before you can learn to walk and so on, but I have no clue where to start. I work best with step by step instructions and my problem is I want to learn and know things right away. I went to http://www.linux.org/lessons/beginner/index.html and followed the courses using an extra Dell I have in my office. [...] This approach didn't work for me and there are so many distributions of Linux and different GUI interfaces I'm not sure where to begin, any suggestions?

The linux.org resources are a bit outdated unfortunately. You can read the First steps in GNU/Linux (http://polishlinux.org/first-steps/) section on polishlinux.org as a startup point. Then, just google for specific problems/issues.

Hope it's helpful,
Borys

[mrBen]

The best way to learn is to install an easy to use Linux distro (personally, I like Ubuntu, but Fedora/SuSE/Mandriva will all likely do the job) and then try to do the things you would normally do. When you can't, search the web to find out how to do them. Eventually you will be able to do all your normal tasks with Linux rather than Windows.

Oh, and whenever you're reading anything about learning Linux online, check the dates on it. The Linux world moves _very_ fast, and so stuff that may have been true in 2003 are no longer true in 2006. Hell - some of the stuff that was true in 2005 is no longer true!

[michux]

Oh, and whenever you're reading anything about learning Linux online, check the dates on it. The Linux world moves _very_ fast, and so stuff that may have been true in 2003 are no longer true in 2006. Hell - some of the stuff that was true in 2005 is no longer true!

Yes, this is essential. It's too many times I've been explaining the newcomers that it's really not needed to recompile your kernel anymore to add some basic functionality like data encryption, usb support or wifi :)

Thus, make sure that the information you are getting is reaaly up-to-date. It's probably the best to search for "your_problem your_distro_version", i.e. "wifi support ubuntu edgy eft", etc.

[Sepero]

I agree with what MrBen said.

[rmart0729]

Hello,

Well, after talking to my father in law (who uses and is comfortable with Linux) I have decided to try Red Hat on his recommendation because he knows my learning style and he said I can do anything in Red Hat that I can do in Windows. The questions I forgot to ask him are these:

What is the difference between Red Hat and Fedora and where can I get the latest version of Red Hat or Fedora?

If I'm doing daily tasks (surfing the Web, E-Mail, Office productivity stuff like word, excel, etc, and troubleshooting hardware and software where necessary, etc) how much of the command line will I need to know and where can I learn it? I have only needed the DOS command line in the Windows world when I'm troubleshooting software.

Again, my goal is to get comfortable USING Linux and then become proficient in TROUBLESHOOTING and FIXING Linux when and Where necessary. Just like I do in Windows.

My father in law also told me that with Red Hat updates/upgrades will be free as long as I fill out a survey every once in a while, unlike Lindows where you have to pay.

Any thoughts, opinions, or suggestions would be helpful.

Thanks

[mrrangerman43]

What is the difference between Red Hat and Fedora and where can I get the latest version of Red Hat or Fedora?

As I understand it RedHat no longer makes a desktop OS, their desktop OS is now called fedora which is free, just do a search for it on www.redhat.com and you will find a download link.

Fedora from what I can see so far ( haven't used it very much ) doen't come with little things like flashmedia installed or codecs pre-installed as most free linuxs don't. It uses Yum for a package/manager. All in all not a bad distro.

If I'm doing daily tasks (surfing the Web, E-Mail, Office productivity stuff like word, excel, etc, and troubleshooting hardware and software where necessary, etc) how much of the command line will I need to know and where can I learn it? I have only needed the DOS command line in the Windows world when I'm troubleshooting software.

If you truly want to learn linux and the power it has, learn the command line, www.google.com/linux is your friend. www.justlinux.com is a lifesaver also. There is also a gui for just about anything you will need to do, but it's in the command line where you will learn more about linux and its file structure.
Just my 2cents.

good luck
Dan

[dkeav]

a) none, redhat IS fedora and vice versa, its just the name of their distrobution
b) fedora.redhat.com
c) theoretically none, but realistically support from community is usually going to be in the form of commands for the cli, but luckily you can usually just copy and paste, the command line is by no means a requirement, but as you progress, you will begin to find it more and more useful
e)yes, support is free, no you dont have to fill out surveys(?), support is based in the community, this forum is just one example, learning what your support resources are and how to use them is the most important part of using linux and open source software, learn to ask smart questions to get smart answers, and above all what/how/where to search for answers, forums are a very good source of knowledge that allow you to pick the brains of a large number of members of the community with vast amounts of experience related to whatever subject you want

have fun learning, and dont be afraid to break things or ask questions, (although you might try searching before you ask, most questions have been asked and answered already and a quick search resolves most issues)

enjoy

[blackbelt_jones]

To learn about linux from the console and then work your way X is pretty old school, and probably not how most ordinary desktop users learn these days, but you don't sound like an ordinary desktop user. You can certainly get to the console from any Linux distro, but Slackware is the only distro I know that logs onto the console by default, and lets you start up X at will from there.

What dkeav says about forgetting everything you know about Windows may be true, when I started I had the advantage(?) of not really knowing anything about Windows beyond point and click.

Fedora is a noncommercial desktop distro, one hundred percent free (as in free software), frequently updated and very bleeding edge. The commercial Red Hat Enterprise Distro is updated much less frequently, is much more stable, comes with less entertainment software, has some proprietary packages, and will cost you money. If you're interested in the Enterprise version but don't want to pay, there's CentOS, which is a free distro based on Red Hat Enterprise Linux source code.

The most important thing about Leraning Linux for me has been taking full advantage of this forum, and the accompanying irc chatroom #linuxn00b in irc.freenode.org.

[rmart0729]

Hello,

Well, I have tried several attempts to install Fedora core 6 here at work. I have failed each time because I'm trying to do a network install. I thought downloading the boot.iso file would be quicker than downloading 5 iso images but my computer has been sitting here doing nothing for 2 hours even though it says it is installing.

I'm in Colorado and downloading from the University of Oregon's mirror. Several other mirrors I have tried failed because an selinux.rpm file was missing or corrupt. Any ideas on what mirrors are a little more reliable? I only have one CD-R so that is another reason I went this route. Any ideas?

Thanks

[KenP]

maybe check out http://howtoforge.com/.

they have many tutorials for real world problems and most are from the command line type stuff
eg buiding a LAMP box on debian

Suggest you run through one or 2 and while doing the examples, research a little on every command executed so you can learn what it does and why.

Great little learning exercise and will leave you with a functional box at the end.

KenP