DUAL BOOT (Windows 2000 and Debian)

[particleman]

hello:

I am still trying to get all the info on dual boot as I can and read this site http://www.devhood.com/tutorials/tutorial_details.aspx?tutorial_id=313 I am trying to install debian on a windows 2000 system. I like
the way that suggested here on how to do the dual boot since the Linux loader doesnt touch the MBR. Essentially what the site says is to leave the NTLDR in the MBR untoched and to install the linux loader to the boot sector of the Linux volume.

First some background: I am installing Debian on an HP laptop (model ZV5120ca), I currently have 2 partitions, a c-drive where I have windows 2000 installed which is 17Gbs, then an e-Drive (10GBS) where I have a ghost image of the C- drive, and about 10GBS of empty space which I am planning to dedicate to Linux.

Now I was wondering that since the NTLDR kicks in when the MBR is loaded will in a system that has win 2K installed, does it make a difference configuration (in the boot.ini) wise if I use LILO or GRUB? I ask because according to the directions on the website whatever linux loader I decide to go with will be installed in the boot sector of the linux volume not the MBR
correct? So since the NTLDR will be loaded at boot time FIRST (before the linux loader) I wont really have to worry about configuring GRUB or LILO to recognize windows since essentially the NTLDR will be calling the linux loader (LILO or GRUB, I think this is called chaining or linking) and not the other way around when I choose to boot Linux from the NTLDR menu. Am I
correct to think that way?

Now please correct me if I am wrong, after I install Linux and reboot for the first time, I will be able to boot into windows normally since no changes will have been made to the NTLDR right? but if I want to load Linux after the first reboot, I will have to boot up with a Linux boot floppy, copy the boot record using the dd command to copy the linux loader, reboot, then boot into Windows and change the boot.ini to point to the linux boot record file which I will have copied to the C-drive. correct so far?

My problem is that I dont have a floppy drive yet for my laptop, so I cant boot linux with a boot floppy, so after I am done installing Linux and reboot for the first time, can I boot into Linux with the installation CD? if I can then what command do I have to run? or will the CD pick up the current installation automatically and ask me if I want to boot into it?

Also I know that I said that I wanted to use GRUB instead of LILO, but at this point I really just want to use something that doesnt give me problems during or after installation, and I have read that if I use LILO and upgrade or change the kernel that I will have to reconfigure LILO. is this true? And most importatly that if I change my mind later and just want to go back to using windows and take Linux out of my system, that it is much harder to do if I have LILO instead of GRUB. is that true as well?

I also think that GRUB is only available on the Sarge version of Debian. All I want to be able to do with my Linux system is do some web development (so I will have to install APACHE) although I will not have it out on the internet. or a production environment. Do you think I should go with Sarge? do you think that it will provide more support for my laptp's hardware?

Any help at all would be appreciatted.

[AdamZ]

Originally posted by particleman

Now I was wondering that since the NTLDR kicks in when the MBR is loaded will in a system that has win 2K installed, does it make a difference configuration (in the boot.ini) wise if I use LILO or GRUB? I ask because according to the directions on the website whatever linux loader I decide to go with will be installed in the boot sector of the linux volume not the MBR
correct? So since the NTLDR will be loaded at boot time FIRST (before the linux loader) I wont really have to worry about configuring GRUB or LILO to recognize windows since essentially the NTLDR will be calling the linux loader (LILO or GRUB, I think this is called chaining or linking) and not the other way around when I choose to boot Linux from the NTLDR menu. Am I
correct to think that way?

That's absolutely correct.

Now please correct me if I am wrong, after I install Linux and reboot for the first time, I will be able to boot into windows normally since no changes will have been made to the NTLDR right? but if I want to load Linux after the first reboot, I will have to boot up with a Linux boot floppy, copy the boot record using the dd command to copy the linux loader, reboot, then boot into Windows and change the boot.ini to point to the linux boot record file which I will have copied to the C-drive. correct so far?

Correct.

My problem is that I dont have a floppy drive yet for my laptop, so I cant boot linux with a boot floppy, so after I am done installing Linux and reboot for the first time, can I boot into Linux with the installation CD? if I can then what command do I have to run? or will the CD pick up the current installation automatically and ask me if I want to boot into it?

I'm not sure about this part, but I think you should be able to get out of the installer when it asks you to reboot. If there's no option to exit, you can try pressing ALT-F2 to get into a second virtual console, then do the dd command. Your second problem is, how are you going to get the boot sector image off of the linux partition? Do you have a USB memory key? If not (or if your install won't recognize it at that point) another option is to create a small (10MB) FAT32 partition just for transferring files between OS's. Once you have the boot sector file on the windows partition, you should be able to continue with the instructions normally.

Also I know that I said that I wanted to use GRUB instead of LILO, but at this point I really just want to use something that doesnt give me problems during or after installation, and I have read that if I use LILO and upgrade or change the kernel that I will have to reconfigure LILO. is this true? And most importatly that if I change my mind later and just want to go back to using windows and take Linux out of my system, that it is much harder to do if I have LILO instead of GRUB. is that true as well?

You have to reconfigure both bootloaders when you upgrade your kernel. The only difference is that you don't have to re-run grub. But it's a very small difference. As for getting rid of linux, it also doesn't matter. Just delete the whole partition and reclaim your free space.

I also think that GRUB is only available on the Sarge version of Debian. All I want to be able to do with my Linux system is do some web development (so I will have to install APACHE) although I will not have it out on the internet. or a production environment. Do you think I should go with Sarge? do you think that it will provide more support for my laptp's hardware?

I would recommend going with unstable (I think it's sid right now). Search the forums and google for how to change your sources.list to point to unstable after you've installed. I run unstable myself, and it's really not that unstable.

Hope this helps.

[particleman]

Helped alot thanx!
just one more thing, does unstable have GRUB?

[saikee]

I am not sure what exactly you have done or which method you have decided to go with.

Basically you can

(1) Let Windows control Linux by altering the Windows bootloader which has the exclusive use of the MBR.

(2) Let Linux control Windows by letting Grub or Lilo into MBR

(3) Boot Linux from a floppy and no alteration to Windows

I can only comment on the second and third method as those are the ones I play around with.

My feeling is that you went for the third method and now stuck for not having a floppy drive.

My suggestion is to switch to method 2 in your situation, assuming you will never a chance to use a floppy. (watch out the necessary installation CD and administrator password later)

Run the Linux CD again. It may or may not recognise the installed system (worst case is a full re-installation) and go through the configuration by asking Linux to put Grub into MBR. Thereafter everytime the PC boots you will have a Linux Grub screen presenting to you the choices of booting to Windows or Linux.

This step I have taken a few time and is pretty bomb proof.

Now if thing goes sour you can always get your Win2k back by using the original installation CD, go to the Recovery Console and type "fixmbr" to restore the original MBR. That is pretty bomb proof as well as long as your Win2k is bootable in the first place. You need the original CD in your case and Win2k will ask for the adminstrator's password before letting you into Command mode.

Grub is quite friendly to newbies as it demands very little knowledge in Linux. I got by essentially from the tutorial recommended by the Installation subforum here.

-----------------------------------

If you to go for the first method have a look at John T's signiture. He is good with the first method.

[AdamZ]

Yes, unstable has grub. If you use the new debian installer (http://www.nl.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/), it's quite easy. Grub will be installed for you where you want it. Just remember after you install, change the sources.list file to point to unstable and then upgrade.







(And for saikee, he did choose the first method)