Recommend a distro for specific needs (web devel, java & games)

[kdmf]

G'day all.

I'm a 'Windows' user from Australia wanting to give 'linux' a try. In fact, I've been wanting to give it a go for quite a while now. I've done a bit of searching etc, but seeing as I have a few particular question to ask, I thought that would warrant it's own thread.

I'm not a huge computer user although, I've learnt quite a bit in the past 6 months(not that you need to learn all that much when it comes to using XP). Now considering that....


I'm studying website development and need to use dreamweaver
I like the odd game every now and then but don't play all that often
Netbeans(Java IDE) is needed for UNI
and
I love to learn new things


Which distro would be good for me?

To my understanding, Mandrake would be a good one to start off with. Would you recommend dual boot with both Mandrake and XP? Let me know your thoughts. Thanks in advance.

[merclude]

sounds like you know what you want!

you're most likely going to need that windows there to play some of your games, unless you feel like trying to run them in wine..

other than that i've heard great things about mandrake being a good beginner distro

have at it!

[blackrax]

welcome aboard,

i started out with mandrake (id est, after missing dos for too many years) - the transgression was indeed easy, and should not pose any problems as long as you get your internet up and running (which is very easy in mandrake) and are comfortable with googling the net; most things have already been answered.

personally, i never liked kde or gnome very much, although most beginner's guides use them as templates. read about the different desktops/window managers and see which ones appeal to you. i'd also recommend you to get comfortable with the console commands - they offer immense versatility

circa half a year ago, i switched from mandrkae to gentoo - i was not satisfied with the way mandrake automated things for you - but, as a beginner, it was a relief. my point is: mandrake is definitely a suitable distro for starting out with when learning linux, but don't be afraid to move on to a more 'hardcore/geek/nerdy/l33t' distro once the automation of mandrake starts bugging you.

as for your windows needs, i agree with merclude; dual boot - or install vmware. java, on the other hand, works nicely on linux (does your uni really force you to use netbeans? *shrugs*) - i remeber last time i used windows for real, doing java programming - there was a pesky limit on the length of system variables, had to move all my jar files to a folder closer to the root dir, else windows cut the classpath short) - this will not happen in linux, luckily. take a look at emacs and vim once you've setup your java environment - although, do the tutorials for the editors before banging your head into the wall.

happy linuxing,
//blackrax

edit: if you want to stick with an XP look-and-feel, try xpde desktop environment (http://www.xpde.com/) :D

[deathadder]

Hi kdmf welcome to JL

Originally posted by blackrax
mandrake is definitely a suitable distro for starting out with when learning linux, but don't be afraid to move on to a more 'hardcore/geek/nerdy/l33t' distro once the automation of mandrake starts bugging you.


Mandrake *could* be just the same as one of those hardcore distro's your on about, if you 'turn off' all the automagical parts of Mandrake and do everything by the command line...

I love to learn new things

Thats a great way to start using linux, you will find that you will learn so much stuff while you use linux, some of it might not make sense at first but after a while it just seems so right :)

I would suggest that you do keep your XP install for a while atleast, especially since you need Dreamweaver, I'm not too sure how well it runs under wine but you don't want to spend alot of time tryin to get it to work when you just need to create a site :)

If you can I would also suggest getting another hard drive in your machine so you dont have to resize of recreate the windows partitions to make room for Mandrake or what ever you choose to use, dual booting for me atleast only ever worked when I was using two hard drives in one machine, Windows just seemed to hard having to share its hard drive ;)

Final bit of advice is too google alot and read

Have fun with linux

[mrBen]

Generally I recommend that people start with Knoppix if they've never used Linux before - doesn't touch your harddrive, so you can't break your Windows install.

Once you've been playing around with that, Mandrake is probably a very good starting point. IIRC you _can_ run Dreamweaver under one of the CodeWeavers products, should you wish to run it under Linux, but it'll cost you.

[mdwatts]

Next time please include a subject that relates to the topic being posted as stated in the JL Community Help Posting Guideline sticky thread at the top of this forum.

I've modified the subject this time.

"The newbie of all newbies needs help." :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[kdmf]

Thank you all for the replies.

Sorry about the topic header mdwatts. I'll learn to follow the rules in the future.

ok...So I've decided to go with the original plan. Madrake and XP dual boot.

I'll let you all know how it goes I suppose. Only good things can come out of this. Thanks again.

[lagdawg]

kdmf:

I have done the exact same thing you are doing. Dual booting is nice, especially if there is something you need to do real quick and don't necessarily have the time to set up correctly on linux (my wireless connection on my laptop for example). Mandrake is nice because some of the later versions include the capability of resizing your ntfs Windows XP partition and it is all very easy to do (I had to defrag my hd a few times before mine would work though.) I have never had a problem with dual booting either of my machines and they both work great. Good luck!!! Linux may seem difficult at first, but after you get used to it, it becomes much easier.

[kdmf]

Well, I have two hdd in this machine already. One 40gig and the other 20gig. The 20gig is hardly being used so I'll leave that aside for the distro. Saves me the trouble of having to partition.

[XiaoKJ]

Yeah! Its realli nice seeing the linux community increasing in strength very day....

For windows to linux migrators like me, I recommend Mandrake, Red Hat, FC or SUSE for a start as it is realli similar, esp with KDE.

Then, as they learn the more common tools like mount and dmesg, including compiling kernels(that is surprisingly easy...), I would recommend slack, to familiarise them with the Command LIne. Slack is great as it explains all the packages. Then Gentoo comes along the way.

Finally, for experts-to-be, they can move on to chainsaw and stuff like that. I do not recommend Knoppix-like Live-CDs as they don't even meet Windows' standard in the need for computer knowledge. Mandrake and so on is already so easy with their graphical installations, so it is reduntant to move on from them to RH types.

Also, it is a must for newbies and experts to read all the manuals and these wonderful forums that give you the knowledge of others and their problems that you may never encounter.

kdmf, you are all set to go! Dual-booting is nice and easy, just make sure you are familiar with the boot loaders. For NT kerneled Windows(XP and 2k...), their built-in NT bootloader is nice and functional and is recommended. If else, grub and lilo works too, with grub recommended. However, grub need stages and lilo is known to fail. Grub is nice and versatile, but it needs a 2- stage approach to work so do not format your harddisk if you have grub. for lilo users, you have to take care of yourself!

Dual-booting is the top choice for windows to linux newbies as they can switch anytime! making the transition safe. Just do not mess with your windows partition and you are on the track.

Also, many soft/hardwares need windows to work properly, so dual-booting is feastable.

[kdmf]

Thanks XiaoKJ....alot of the terminology is a little new to me but like I said, I enjoy learning new things. Good to see that a majority of Linux users were once Windows users. Doesn't make me feel like everybody came into this world with a distro in their hands. Speaking of which....I now have to get my hands on the OS.

[kdmf]

Thought I might just post an update....

I've now installed Mandrake Linux 10 and am enjoying it quite a bit. I'm running dual boot MAndrake and windows XP but havent touched XP for a while since the install. :)

It's a little strange but I think I can work my head around it. Things are just a little different, which is understandable with it being a different OS and all.

:) Thanks for all the help.

[deathadder]

Glad to hear that you getting on with it, and enjoying it :)

[kdmf]

Originally posted by deathadder

Thats a great way to start using linux, you will find that you will learn so much stuff while you use linux, some of it might not make sense at first but after a while it just seems so right :)

I'm trying to learn but at the moment, I feel like an absolute noob(and I don't like to use that term all too often). I don't want to have to use the gui at all times. I'm still trying to work out how to change from kde to gnome. :(

[deathadder]

When you get to a logon prompt you should be able to choose what to load kde or gnome. On my install I've got gnome running, with gdm as the logon manager, it gives me the option 'Session', which when I click brings up a box of other window managers I can choose. Have a look for something similiar next time you go to logon

EDIT
As for not using the GUI all the time, next time you want to see whats in your home directory use a shell to look instead of a gui tool, konsole or what ever it happens to be. If you do little things like this you will soon find that you do more and more with the cli. In the NHF I think theres a basic bash guide you could have a read of. Have a look at them here

http://www.justlinux.com/nhf
http://www.justlinux.com/nhf/Shells/Basic_Console_Commands.html

[kdmf]

Thanks you deathadder. I was never very good at bash commands but I hope that doesn't make me unsuitable for a linux OS.

Anyway....in reference to the kde to gnome issue, this is what is displayed when I first open mandrake linux:

___________________________
Mandrake linux etc. etc.
Kernel 2.4.25-etc. etc.
localhost login:.........................

password:................................

Then I would see

Last Login etc. etc.
[info etc]$
___________________________

At this point, I type in kde and it takes me to the gui. I've tried gnome but that didn't work. I'm pretty sure it's installed.

There is no "session" option.

[deathadder]

So your taken to a text based login instead of a gui, right?

Have you tried running 'startx' instead of kde, if running 'startx' takes your to gnome then, thats sorted, if not you can change what startx loads, can't remember how at the moment but I'll have a look later.

Double check to make sure that gnome is installed, either a 'locate gnome' or 'whereis gnome'. If you get a error with 'locate gnome' about running updatedb 'su -' to root then run updatedb, it may take a while because its indexing your hard drive, the try the locate command again.

I believe, but I'm not sure, that Mandrake has a tool for changing the default DE/WM, another thing to look into :)

[kdmf]

Thank you for that deathadder. startx seemed to work a treat. I even noticed a few others in there, but I'll just stuck with gnome for now. Thanks again for the help.

[deathadder]

No problem, glad I could help

[XiaoKJ]

I think you have a problem with initscripts.

In mandrake, things should get graphical after startup. Thus, it should startx by itself. Did you wait till everything is done before logging in? Let it run and you will meet a graphical login script that can let you choose login managers and stuff nicely.

If not, try to read some manuals to change the initscript.

For me, I would recommend people to use KDE first, while familiarising with the command line there as it would be less intimidating. Konsole is after all, an emulator that could be closed whenever you feel uneasy. After that you can proceed to more of the command line and there is no need to learn gnome -- its really for the diehard linux users. learning the command line gets you more of gnome each day, and it would be easy to use gnome too. migrating to gnome just needs you to find the difference in the layout.

[deathadder]

I think you have a problem with initscripts...In mandrake, things should get graphical after startup. Thus, it should startx by itself. Did you wait till everything is done before logging in? Let it run and you will meet a graphical login script that can let you choose login managers and stuff nicely. Not if kdmf chose to enter that run level. Either during the install or by manually changing the run level.

When it comes to the whole KDE or gnome thing kdmf made the choice, of which to use.

What do you mean by:


its really for the diehard linux users. learning the command line gets you more of gnome each day, and it would be easy to use gnome too.
I cant see how knowing the command line would make a graphical interface easier to use :confused: