Gentoo Ownz - One Man's Mini-Review

[David Anderson]

About a year ago I put Redhat 8 on my machine. This was the beginning of my migration away from Windows XP. I have no real complaints about XP. It's a memory hog, and you don't get near the amount of customization you get with Linux, but it's a relatively stable OS, albeit bloated. And while I don't like Microsoft as a company, that's not reason enough for me to ditch them. I do make my living supporting Microsoft products - I'm a computer technician.

My main reason for going to Linux was to learn it. I rate myself as an intermediate user. I've installed a few web servers with Linux, and even setup a few Samba machines. I've done kernel recompiles and lots of other semi-technical things. But to me, you can't really know the ins and outs of something unless you live it. Thus the switch.

Redhat was all well and good, but I really wanted to learn manual configuation. Redhat had too many of their own tools for this. After Redhat decided to move their desktop OS to Fedora, I decided to give Gentoo a try. I may end up installing Redhat on a spare machine in the future, just for RHCE preparation, should I decide to do that.

Okay, onto Gentoo. I spent the last few days installing it. There's tons of manual work during the install (I did Stage 1). I have a P4-2.5 w/1gb RAM, so all the compiles didn't bother me too much. Sadly, after I finished the initial install, I managed to corrupt my Resier filesystem as I was trying to repair it. I don't know much about Reiser, so I'm sure this was my fault. I had to redo the whole install with ext2. Fortunately, all the little mistakes I made during the first install were easily avoided in the second.

Here I am installed and running. There is definitely a noticable speed improvement over Redhat. Similar setups in terms of desktops, kernels, etc. Right now I'd say it's ~20% faster, though that could be a high estimate. I'll have to use it some more to determine that.

The big winner for Gentoo is emerge/portage. It's an incredible tool, though not 100% effective. I've noticed on several occasions it failed obtaining a file it was attemping to download due to a server being down or inaccessible for some reason. I would have to manually get the file and drop it into /usr/portage/distfiles. This is no big deal to me, however. I'm just surprised they don't have multiple locations for a specific file, in case a server is down. Maybe they do for some files; I don't really know. The big plus for emerge is it's ability to determine dependencies and automatically download and install them for you. This is HUGE. Dependency nightmares was easily my biggest complaint with Linux. Emerge is a real savior in this department. I know Debian has apt-get. I went with Gentoo simply because their community seems to welcome new users.

In conclusion: Gentoo is a winner - for the right user. Ideally you want a faster machine and a broadband Internet connection to take full advantage of Gentoo. My machine runs 24/7, so compiles - even for large software - don't bother me. I'll simply start it before I go to bed, or SSH in from work and get it going.

It's is now my desktop of choice. There is a lot of manual work to getting it installed and getting all your hardware going, but the dependency headaches that will be saved thanks to emerge make it more than worth the effort. Not to mention the speed improvement from compiling all of your own software - optimized for your system.

[Matatas]

True, I hate that dependencies things, maybe when I learn more about Linux I´ll try Gentoo, Debian or Slackware...

[nextbillgates]

Originally posted by Matatas
True, I hate that dependencies things, maybe when I learn more about Linux I´ll try Gentoo, Debian or Slackware...

If you hate dependancies, Slackware is not for you.

[serz]

Originally posted by nextbillgates
If you hate dependancies, Slackware is not for you.
Why's that? Slackware doesn't have dependency problems really.

[bandwidth_pig]

"Sadly, after I finished the initial install, I managed to corrupt my Resier filesystem as I was trying to repair it. I don't know much about Reiser, so I'm sure this was my fault."

Ironic. I too installed Gentoo this week and had the same problem. I managed to corrupt my Resier filesystem too. But being stubborn, I just toasted the install and started again. I really like Gentoo also. I have found some packages from portage don't compile (Open Office for example)...but thats no big deal. I was pleased. Good distro that throws a interesting curve into the whole thing by bringing some of GCCs potential out in the open. It is a interesting distro and it's making me think about some things in a new light.

[nextbillgates]

Originally posted by serz
Why's that? Slackware doesn't have dependency problems really.

Slackware has relatively few packages, and not many Linux software projects have a .tgz for Slackware users. The only other alternatives are rpm2tgz or manually compiling from source, both of which are a pain in the *** due to lack of dependency checking.

[Matatas]

mmhhh... probably Debian would be the next distro I would try... It´s one of the most used ones according to Linux Counter...

[afterthefall]

After having made the switch from Slack to Gentoo, I can safely say that if I were to go back to a binary distribution, I would go with Debian. emerge is a great tool, although it could use a few features (reverse dependency resolution for unmerges would be fantastic), and over all, I have have far fewer problems with Gentoo than even with my beloved Slackware. Package management will be the key to being the winning Linux distribution.

The main problem I had with Slackware was the lack of packages. Converting an .rpm to a slackpack always bothered me because of the dependency hell I went through during my brief stint with RH8. The main reason Slackware doesn't have dependency problems is that most everything ends up being compiled from source and you have to resolve the dependencies on your own, thus making it far less of a problem.

- Brian

[DerekKraan]

I used to run Slackware...and before that Debian, and even more before that Mandrake, but I've settled on Gentoo. Why? Because I ended up installing everything from source anyways! Now I don't have to worry about dependencies, and it's always a snap to upgrade my entire distro(although time consuming).

[soda_popstar]

Originally posted by DerekKraan
Because I ended up installing everything from source anyways!

I totally hear ya! I was considering Slackware, but then I realized that I'd have to compile everything "by hand". But since Gentoo makes it so easy to compile, I went with it instead. :D It's a fairly involved install, but it's not too bad. I just did a fresh install on my brand new laptop and it only took me a day to get it to be functional (from stage one, even).

[sclebo05]

i want to thank the original poster for the mini-review. i have kicked around trying gentoo for a while, but i fear i might run back to my trusty slackware at the first sign of danger. the only thing i have doubts about is the compiling. does it compile everything you install? does that get tedious?

[David Anderson]

Originally posted by sclebo05
i want to thank the original poster for the mini-review. i have kicked around trying gentoo for a while, but i fear i might run back to my trusty slackware at the first sign of danger. the only thing i have doubts about is the compiling. does it compile everything you install? does that get tedious?

You can install RPM under Gentoo. And I recall reading on Gentoo's site that they have a binary package system of some sort. During the install you can start at later stages, which ends up with more binaries and less compiling (meaning faster installer). But, all of that defeats the purpose, really. And for emerge, everything has to compile, at least as far as I know.

I don't find the compiling tedious now that I have the system up and running. Tonight, before I got to bed, I'm doing an emerge to install a few more apps.

Also, I forgot to mention in the review - Gentoo's site has some great documentation. It was very helpful during the install.

[soda_popstar]

You do have to compile most things with Gentoo. However, they release a 2-CD set for every major version (the latest being 1.4). The first CD is necessary for the initial boot and the second CD is optional, which has a lot of precompiled software like KDE, GNOME, Mozilla, OpenOffice.org, etc.

You can learn more about Gentoo from their installation handbook (http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handbook.xml?part=1). :D

[MMYoung]

Originally posted by Matatas
mmhhh... probably Debian would be the next distro I would try... It´s one of the most used ones according to Linux Counter...
If you want to give Debian a whirl, I suggest MEPIS (http://www.mepis.org). Live CD, easy install, GREAT hardware detection, apt-get :). 'Nuff said.

Later,
MMYoung

BTW, I've got Gentoo on CD and am going to give it a whirl myself after the first of the year. Going to spend the next few days reading/printing their documentation, especially anything on kernel complies, never done it so I figure it's about time.

[DFo3D]

If you install Gentoo, use knoppix to install it!

It's alot easier via knoppix as you have a fully functional distro to install it with, and you don't have to be stuck w/the gentoo livecd.

Plus if you corrupt your filesystem during the install, all the reiserfs tools are on knoppix. Just run reiserfs_fsck and then reiserfs-rebuild-tree if anything goes wrong.

Plus, you can get to all of the documentation w/knoppix. If you want the instructions for knoppix, just go here http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/altinstall.xml

and then here

http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/gentoo-x86-install.xml

If you are a Linux whiz just go here for quick reference install instructions.

http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/gentoo-x86-quickinstall.xml

Before doing anything w/portage after your system is built, read these too

http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/portage-user.xml
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/portage-manual.xml
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/use-howto.xml

Personally I found the USE howto the most useful, as I was surprised how many packages I was building w/o 3dnow support, dvd support, etc.

[VolcomPimp]

Gentoo's no doubt one of the best distro's around...
As said above, just use knoppix to install it...
It's really easy since you can open up a browser on the
same comp and read the docs as you're installing instead
of readin them on a second comp or through links.
I installed debian from knoppix the other day on my laptop
and installed synaptic because I'd never actually used
apt before and I was really impressed...
I think debian really has it on gentoo in the area of gui package
management. Only problem w/ knoppix is that you don't
have a choice in what to install....
debian's ISOs suck because the hardware detection is horrible
and the installer is just really ghetto...
Though I was able to install a system from debootstrap from knoppix
pretty easilly but I'm still having problems w/ getting my
Orinoco silver card on my laptop. (if anyone's got a link it'd be appreciated)
I havnt used gentoo on my desktop much lately cause of some issues
I'd encountered which I don't feel like fixing yet since I'm just gonna
format and install reiser4 soon (probly next snapshot).
Debian and Gentoo are real solid distro's.
If you compile from source a lot and absolutely must have
that level of customization then stick w/ gentoo....
also swaret/slapt both suck really bad compared to apt.

[j79zlr]

Originally posted by nextbillgates
Slackware has relatively few packages, and not many Linux software projects have a .tgz for Slackware users. The only other alternatives are rpm2tgz or manually compiling from source, both of which are a pain in the *** due to lack of dependency checking.

Are you trolling?

Slackware has plenty of packages, and I have yet to have any dependency issues with slackware using swaret. Linuxpackages.net has over 2800 slackware packages.

[hard candy]

Two advantages Slack has over Gentoo:
1. You can join the Church of the Subgenius-- Praise BOB!
2. Telling people you are a "Slacker" (especially if you tell them you are a "Major Slacker") is way cooler than telling them you are a "Gentooer".
Who cares about package management- would you rather wear a T shirt saying "Kiss me- I use Portage" or one that said "This Slacker knows your daughter"?

[VolcomPimp]

I'd much rather be a gentooer...
slacks alright if you just need a simple easy to install
system that's secure for a server or somethin...
But for a desktop it's nothing compared to debian
or gentoo.
I only used swaret for a few days and already I had
a few dependency problems w/ it.
It's package management system is simple and I liked
it b4 I tried gentoo or debian.
But custom packages using makepkg were a nightmare.
Gentoo's portage was much better although time
consuming because of all the compiling I was doing
but once I tried debian, it put slackwares package management
to shame. Synaptic was perfect compared to any
portage front-end and using it or dselect was much
better than pkgtool.

Only good part about using slackware was calling my
laptop my slacktop. Other than that, I don't see any
real reason to use it for a desktop or laptop.

[X_console]

I use both Slack and Gentoo. :D
/me feels 1337

Well I use Slack on the servers, mainly because it's quick to install and relatively painless to maintain. And I use Gentoo on my iBook simply because out of all the Linux distros for PPC, Gentoo is the most customizable (IMHO).

[Sepero]

Originally posted by j79zlr
Slackware has plenty of packages, and I have yet to have any dependency issues with slackware using swaret. Linuxpackages.net has over 2800 slackware packages. Wow, and I'm always wishing Debian had more packages. Debian only has somewhere over 8000.

[JohnT]

Slackware has no dependency issues...its that knot on the end of the keyboard that needs medical attention.:D

[AndrewLubinus89]

Slackware has surprisingly little dependency problems. I don't really get it but I have much less package management problems with slackware than I did with rh or mdk. I don't use swaret I just compile from source. If for whatever reason it doesn't work I'll just rpm2tgz it and it will generally work ok. Once I settled big dependencies of course (sdl, etc...)

[viperlin]

Gentoo rules.

[XiaoKJ]

corrupted reiserfs? Upgrade to reiserfs 4!

Dependancies are not to be worried about -- in gentoo you can automatically resolve them without spoiling your system!

Gentoo rocks -- if I had the time I would not be living off slack!

[hard candy]

Gentoo rocks -- if I had the time I would not be living off slack!
I am slack-jawed, how do you make a living off Slackware? :D

[JohnT]

Originally posted by hard candy
I am slack-jawed, how do you make a living off Slackware? :D By selling Slack cd's to previous Gentoo users:D

[mangeli]

Originally posted by nextbillgates
If you hate dependancies, Slackware is not for you.

I call BS!!!

I'm using slackware 9.1 with swaret and it handles the deps for me!!

And people say that slackware doesn't have good package management!

[carbon-12]

Originally posted by Sepero
Wow, and I'm always wishing Debian had more packages. Debian only has somewhere over 8000.

Actually they had an article about this @ distrowatch.com. It turns out APT has about 14,000 packages!!!Mostly libs though.

[sclebo05]

just throwing in a vote for slackware, and i also want to point out that slackware is probably the best distro for compiling packages yourself. this is because slackware makes every attempt to use pure, unmodified packages in the distro. so if a tar.gz is looking for a lib or file in a certain location, it will be right where it should be......

oh, and slapt-get has won me over from swaret, might be worth a look....

[JohnT]

Originally posted by sclebo05
oh, and slapt-get has won me over from swaret, might be worth a look.... What swayed you?:confused:

[bandwidth_pig]

Originally posted by JohnT
By selling Slack cd's to previous Gentoo users:D

And then sell those people FreeBSD CDs! :D

Heheh...they are all good distros. The best of the best.

[sclebo05]

two things swayed me. they may seem like little things to others, but they matter to me. first, i use debian at work, and since the syntax of slapt-get is so similar to apt, i find it easy to know only one set of commands (they are a bit different, but fairly close). second, i broke one of my slack 9.1 boxes TWICE with swaret. I don't have details, but BOTH times slapt-get was able to finish the updates and fix the system - after the second time, i never looked back. both are good systems, but slapt-get just fits my needs better. just my experience.....

[starrwulfe]

Been watchin too much Dave Chappele....

I started out my whole Linux oddesey back in 99-2000 with Mandrake 7, then progressed with MDK up until around 9.1 or so. this was on my home machine, a Athlon 750 with 256 mb ram and a 40 gig HD. along the way I tried Debian potato (hard-*** install, but it worked...) Slack (really hard, and didnt like the whole TGZ thing-- personal choice...) and sloged it out with MDK because it was easy to use at home. Once MDK started to change their distrobution tactics (ain't linux supposed to be FREE? Why do I gotta join some club to get the latest toys?) I went looking for some other distro... I always liked compiling from source, and I had been using fink on an old iMac anyway so I ran and got a used laptop and put gentoo on there. I knew the install would be challenging, but hey I had a weekend to kill... I've been using it ever since, and ended up building my new computer/server at home based on Gentoo. I never felt more in control. Incedintally, I no longer use windows unless I have to at school, or work. I have 2 computers and a laptop that run nothing but gentoo...

Gentoo 4 life!

[XiaoKJ]

Living off slack as I have no time to install gentoo lah... not earning a cent out of it....:D

swaret and emerge is mostly SIMILAR but emerge is always better -- also emerge is bundled with gentoo but you need to download swaret for slackware, which I had to figure it myself...:mad:

slapt-get? does it use debian servers:confused::D

Also emerge makes everything to the best bet -- no need to take care of where dependancies go, just emerge and you are done!

BTW slackware's directories are less updated:D

G4L -- Gentoo 4 life!

[sclebo05]

slapt-get? does it use debian servers:confused::D

No, it uses slackware mirrors

BTW slackware's directories are less updated:D

The price you pay for stability. If it appears on a slackware mirror, even in testing, its still pretty good. Most of the packages are straight compiles, so not too much to worry about.

[XiaoKJ]

your sig says something rational, so do not go against it...



:D jUz JoKiN'

[hard candy]

Living off slack as I have no time to install gentoo lah... not earning a cent out of it....

You mean you do not have 3 days free to install Gentoo? :) So you went with Slack because of ....?
Maybe stability? Maybe a 30 minute install? Easy to set up? Did not need 2 computers- so you could check the forums when you ran into a problem during the Xfree compile?
Admit it, you are a Slacker. Come out of the closet into the light, accept who you are!
"XiaoKJ- seriously Slack and proud of it"
:D

[XiaoKJ]

Originally posted by hard candy
You mean you do not have 3 days free to install Gentoo? :) So you went with Slack because of ....?
Maybe stability? Maybe a 30 minute install? Easy to set up? Did not need 2 computers- so you could check the forums when you ran into a problem during the Xfree compile?
Admit it, you are a Slacker. Come out of the closet into the light, accept who you are!
"XiaoKJ- seriously Slack and proud of it"
:D

HEY!!!:mad:
I just don't have half a day to spare after installing slack(for testing my skills!)[stupid slack taking so much of my time and not delivering...:p]

I am a SLACKER in english not in linux.:D

BTW Slack is not stabler, easier to setup or anything -- I now regret testing slack because of all this mess....

BTW You cannot install any other distro while talking in this forum like Gentoo -- and no, I am talking about a major and powerful distro like gentoo!:D

PS: I would like to try stage1 on gentoo but I figured I don't have amd64 so its not worth it...:D

PPS: Stop spamming me! I hate to flame when I feel so hot in S'pore summer!

EDIT: stop drawing attention to slack in a thread for gentoo! At least go to debian and other distros for goodness sake -- don't neglect them:D

[hard candy]

PPS: Stop spamming me! I hate to flame when I feel so hot in S'pore summer!

I apologize, did not mean to antagonize you. :(

[JohnT]

HEY!!!
I just don't have half a day to spare after installing slack(for testing my skills!)[stupid slack taking so much of my time and not delivering...]

I am a SLACKER in english not in linux.

BTW Slack is not stabler, easier to setup or anything -- I now regret testing slack because of all this mess.... He.he...Slack strikes again:D

[Sepero]

Originally posted by XiaoKJ
BTW You cannot install any other distro while talking in this forum like Gentoo -- and no, I am talking about a major and powerful distro like gentoo!:DWhat? No comprehendo?


EDIT: stop drawing attention to slack in a thread for gentoo! At least go to debian and other distros for goodness sakeI would have mentioned something earlier, but you guys looked like you were having so much fun! LOL :p

[JohnT]

Originally posted by XiaoKJ
Living off slack as I have no time to install gentoo lah... not earning a cent out of it....:D

swaret and emerge is mostly SIMILAR but emerge is always better -- also emerge is bundled with gentoo but you need to download swaret for slackware, which I had to figure it myself...:mad:

slapt-get? does it use debian servers:confused::D

Also emerge makes everything to the best bet -- no need to take care of where dependancies go, just emerge and you are done!

BTW slackware's directories are less updated:D

G4L -- Gentoo 4 life!

quote:EDIT: stop drawing attention to slack in a thread for gentoo! At least go to debian and other distros for goodness sake OK...who's first?:D

[gehidore]

Originally posted by David Anderson
About a year ago I put Redhat 8 on my machine. This was the beginning of my migration away from Windows XP. I have no real complaints about XP. It's a memory hog, and you don't get near the amount of customization you get with Linux, but it's a relatively stable OS, albeit bloated. And while I don't like Microsoft as a company, that's not reason enough for me to ditch them. I do make my living supporting Microsoft products - I'm a computer technician.

My main reason for going to Linux was to learn it. I rate myself as an intermediate user. I've installed a few web servers with Linux, and even setup a few Samba machines. I've done kernel recompiles and lots of other semi-technical things. But to me, you can't really know the ins and outs of something unless you live it. Thus the switch.

Redhat was all well and good, but I really wanted to learn manual configuation. Redhat had too many of their own tools for this. After Redhat decided to move their desktop OS to Fedora, I decided to give Gentoo a try. I may end up installing Redhat on a spare machine in the future, just for RHCE preparation, should I decide to do that.

Okay, onto Gentoo. I spent the last few days installing it. There's tons of manual work during the install (I did Stage 1). I have a P4-2.5 w/1gb RAM, so all the compiles didn't bother me too much. Sadly, after I finished the initial install, I managed to corrupt my Resier filesystem as I was trying to repair it. I don't know much about Reiser, so I'm sure this was my fault. I had to redo the whole install with ext2. Fortunately, all the little mistakes I made during the first install were easily avoided in the second.

Here I am installed and running. There is definitely a noticable speed improvement over Redhat. Similar setups in terms of desktops, kernels, etc. Right now I'd say it's ~20% faster, though that could be a high estimate. I'll have to use it some more to determine that.

The big winner for Gentoo is emerge/portage. It's an incredible tool, though not 100% effective. I've noticed on several occasions it failed obtaining a file it was attemping to download due to a server being down or inaccessible for some reason. I would have to manually get the file and drop it into /usr/portage/distfiles. This is no big deal to me, however. I'm just surprised they don't have multiple locations for a specific file, in case a server is down. Maybe they do for some files; I don't really know. The big plus for emerge is it's ability to determine dependencies and automatically download and install them for you. This is HUGE. Dependency nightmares was easily my biggest complaint with Linux. Emerge is a real savior in this department. I know Debian has apt-get. I went with Gentoo simply because their community seems to welcome new users.

In conclusion: Gentoo is a winner - for the right user. Ideally you want a faster machine and a broadband Internet connection to take full advantage of Gentoo. My machine runs 24/7, so compiles - even for large software - don't bother me. I'll simply start it before I go to bed, or SSH in from work and get it going.

It's is now my desktop of choice. There is a lot of manual work to getting it installed and getting all your hardware going, but the dependency headaches that will be saved thanks to emerge make it more than worth the effort. Not to mention the speed improvement from compiling all of your own software - optimized for your system.

gentoo is a life saver!

[JohnT]

Originally posted by gehidore
gentoo is a life saver!
Yes I remember reading only last week about Gentoo saving three children from a burning house. :eek:

[reiign]

Originally posted by JohnT
Yes I remember reading only last week about Gentoo saving three children from a burning house. :eek:


LoL.

/me points out to JohnT that gehidore but remember that JohnT is aware.

gehidore is in love with Linux (even though he doesnt have it installed At The Moment)

[XiaoKJ]

Originally posted by JohnT
OK...who's first?:D [/B]

YOU!! OF COURSE!!!

Not Funny!:mad:

At least hard candy stopped it :)

Sepero, I meant that you could install gentoo from knoppix cds. I doubt any other MAJOR distro allows that.
I know the existance of small distros capable of that but Gentoos a first in the field to do that -- everythings done by chrooting, and there is no need to use the provided CDs. Isnt it nice?:D

Every distro has its pros and cons, just that Gentoo makes me like it more than others...

[JohnT]

Originally posted by XiaoKJ
YOU!! OF COURSE!!!

Not Funny!:mad:

At least hard candy stopped it :)
Hey lighten up "Idiot King #350544". you take everything way to seriously.:D

[XiaoKJ]

Originally posted by JohnT
Hey lighten up "Idiot King #350544". you take everything way to seriously.:D

Not BAD!:D

[gtalum]

I'm still a major newbie despite using Linux for ~18 months and Gentoo for a year. However I'd liek to add my (probably useless!) praise to Gentoo. It's really not as difficult to install and operate as its reputation implies. This is due in no small part to the assistance of this fine community and the amazing Gentoo community for issues more specific to Gentoo itself. The install is complex the firts time you do it, but if you can read it is straightforawrd enough with the Gentoo install guide at gentoo.org (http://www.gentoo.org) . I have learned an amazing amount about Linux by using Gentoo, without the constant frustration of dependencies in other distros. I started with mandrake for about 6 months to pick up the very basics of using Linux, but quickly graduated to Gentoo.

[gehidore]

Originally posted by reiign
LoL.

/me points out to JohnT that gehidore but remember that JohnT is aware.

gehidore is in love with Linux (even though he doesnt have it installed At The Moment)

hey what you talking boy??!??!

having it installed, and not having the machine its install on be bootable a two very different things.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

and for the record i stole a powersupply from the local highschool an they dont get it back untill mine comes in the mail. so now i am in gentoo, and its still a lifesaver

JohnT when im stuck in the ocean i WILL be able to use my gentoo disks as life preservers

[JohnT]

Guess what..my powersupply came UPS about 10 minutes ago:D

[gehidore]

Originally posted by JohnT
Guess what..my powersupply came UPS about 10 minutes ago:D

thats seems resonable because their in texas and your in texas so a 1-2 turnaround time seems resonable, but remember im the pinetree infested tartory of washington.

[JohnT]

Originally posted by gehidore
thats seems resonable because their in texas and your in texas so a 1-2 turnaround time seems resonable, but remember im the pinetree infested tartory of washington. But your seething unreasonabilty right now I bet. LOL :D :D
Check your PM's

[gehidore]

Originally posted by JohnT
But your seething unreasonabilty right now I bet. LOL :D :D
Check your PM's


speaking of these wonderfull powersupplies hows it working? which one did you get? what "upgrades"?

[JohnT]

Originally posted by gehidore
speaking of these wonderfull powersupplies hows it working? which one did you get? what "upgrades"? The one you pointed me too...I'll try it out my next days off....no upgrades, but a warranty.:eek:

[Loki3]

Emm... Emmm taste the flame-broiled goodness. Never ever start a thread with the word "OWNZ" in it if you want it to be a serious one.

:D

Bandwidth waste.

[XiaoKJ]

Umm.... the feeling of gentoo flowing in your arteries is sooooo DAMN GOOD!:D

//me had just installed gentoo...

[JohnT]

Umm.... the feeling of gentoo flowing in your arteries is sooooo DAMN GOOD!:D

//me had just installed gentoo... Yea..like a nice cheap $1.00 bottle of wine on a cold winters night, laying out next to the dumpster behind the greasy spoon at 3am covered with yesterdays newspaper. That is heaven:p

[hard candy]

I think this fellow just finished a Gentoo installation on a 28k modem:

This is the man booting up the installation disk:

Just Starting Installation (http://www2.sjsu.edu/depts/it/edit272/graphics/photo.gif)

Post Gentoo installation (http://www.scarepros.com/i/Masks%20&%20Robes/Wino.jpg)

[JohnT]

Good one HC...:D

[XiaoKJ]

Originally posted by hard candy
I think this fellow just finished a Gentoo installation on a 28k modem:

This is the man booting up the installation disk:

Just Starting Installation (http://www2.sjsu.edu/depts/it/edit272/graphics/photo.gif)

Post Gentoo installation (http://www.scarepros.com/i/Masks%20&%20Robes/Wino.jpg)

WOW! I am not even anywhere that age!

[JohnT]

Originally posted by XiaoKJ
WOW! I am not even anywhere that age! Not at the moment:D

[gehidore]

Originally posted by hard candy
I think this fellow just finished a Gentoo installation on a 28k modem:

This is the man booting up the installation disk:

Just Starting Installation (http://www2.sjsu.edu/depts/it/edit272/graphics/photo.gif)

Post Gentoo installation (http://www.scarepros.com/i/Masks%20&%20Robes/Wino.jpg)

im going to do this just to see how long it takes! haha

bring it on juno!

[JohnT]

Originally posted by gehidore
im going to do this just to see how long it takes! haha

bring it on juno! Hope it's the
" BLAZINGLY FAST HIGH SPEED" Dial-Up.:D

[gehidore]

Originally posted by JohnT
Hope it's the
" BLAZINGLY FAST HIGH SPEED" Dial-Up.:D \\

no im gonna pop out the old 28kbps data fax modem 2.0 kbps!! see how long it takes to do base kernel 2.6.6 xorg kde and fluxbox

[JohnT]

Originally posted by gehidore
\\

no im gonna pop out the old 28kbps data fax modem 2.0 kbps!! see how long it takes to do base kernel 2.6.6 xorg kde and fluxbox Time to send the kids to college:D

[TheChuckster]

I installed Gentoo on a 28.8k in a week.

[hard candy]

I installed Gentoo on a 28.8k in a week.
I have to admire your patience, persistence, and your telephone company for not dropping the connection too much. What was it like?

[JohnT]

Originally posted by TheChuckster
I installed Gentoo on a 28.8k in a week. I have to admire your humour:D

[Sepero]

Originally posted by TheChuckster
I installed Gentoo on a 28.8k in a week. And let me guess, you have a beowolf cluster to compile it for you? :rolleyes:

I have 28.8k and I stopped installing Gentoo after the 2nd week.

[man_exec]

I recently decided to compile a Linux installation from scratch. I am not a programmer or a professional writer. I am however, very enthused with Linux and want to offer my experiences to other non-programmers in the hope that it will inspire or invite them to take the plunge from Windows to Linux. I also hope that my comments will be read by programmers, to see opportunities for themselves to make their Linux creations more available to non-programmers.

To preface this article, I want to say that I don't believe that any one distro is better, worse, good or bad. I really know very little about Linux and this story should be proof of that. So, to the programmers that read about my mistakes with their creations, please don't be offended.

Why did I want to compile from source?

I've been using PC's since 1989. I used MS DOS, Win 3.11, Win 95/NT4.0/XP. Back with DOS and Win 3.11, I grew used to constantly tweaking the system files and memory settings in order to install a new program. I think that experience actually gave me the perseverance to dive into my new OS repeatedly. A trait that is really helpful in Linux. Or, as my spouse says - I like messing with things and I'm a control freak. No need to comment further on that subject.

I started using Linux about 15 months ago. I built a working PC from the scraps of three discarded PC's I found when walking the dog. I named this PC, the frankenputer because I created life from the parts of dead PC's. I thought that if I had a free PC, I might as well try a free OS. So...Linux it was.

I used Mandrake for almost one year. I loved how easily it installed. However, my nvidia geforce2 mx400 didn't work as well in Linux as it did in Windows XP.

(Note to beginners - create a dual-boot system! It was extremely helpful for getting drivers, .iso images to burn and access to the User Forums to get questions answered. Don't cut your umbilical cord to e-mail, web surfing and games. You may need to blow off some steam in Castle Wolfenstein.)

Mandrake is great, but I couldn't get the graphics to perform as quickly. Yes, I do know that the nvidia drivers are a 'challenge'. Still, I have what I have and I want what I want. Also, with Mandrake I noticed that while installing programs from source, Mandrake sometimes had locations for files that differed slightly from the source code's expectations. This meant to me, that often when installing a program that wasn't on the Mandrake CD-Rom, I would have failed installs and need to explore the system for files.

Then, I jumped into Slackware. I chose it because Red Hat's package management was similar to Mandrake and because I wanted to learn a little more about how Linux works. I also heard that Slackware is very Unix-like and that intrigued me. I got along with Slackware pretty well and had better luck compiling programs. Still, I didn't get the video performance that I wanted. I also ran into some of the same installation problems when compiling from souce - dependencies and file location preferences.

I had been reading about getting the best performance by using a source-based distro for months and decided to take the plunge. Actually, I had studied source-based distros from www.distrowatch.com early on in my Linux adventure. I even tried Lunar, SourceMage, Sorcerer and Gentoo in my first month. However, as a beginner I was in way over my head! My knowledge gap was too big and installing from the prompt or ncurses was too scary.

How did I prepare?

As I said, I had a dual boot. I dowloaded a free program for Windows called the Belarc Advisor. I used it to verify my hardware. I printed the manuals for all my hardware, MB, graphics card, NIC, Monitor, HDD's, etc. I backed up my e-mail and saved files on a separate drive and configured my e-mail program to leave mail on the POP server of my Internet provider. Then, I printed the installation documents for the distro that I would use, punched them into a 3-ring binder.

I also gave myself two mental tools. First, I set a goal of success in at least 30 days. This is good practice because most CD-Rom installations (Mandrake, Slackware, Windows, etc.) all happen pretty quickly and that expectation needs to go. Compiling is slow and if someone like me is doing it, it goes REAL slow! I make many mistakes and there's a lot that I don't know about Linux. Which leads to my second mental tool - I gave myself permission to make lots of mistakes. The files were saved, e-mail and addresses wouldn't be lost, so all I needed to do was keep at it and be patient. Expect the process to take a long time - longer than you think.

What happened?

Remember, none of my experiences and challenges are distro based. They're me based. What I know and really - what I don't know are the main factors in how things turned out.

I started with Lunar Linux 1.4.0. After a few stops and starts inside the installation, I was able to boot into the Lunar Linux. The installation instructions were OK. I definitely recommend access to the user forum for this one. I started the basic lin process (lin perl, lin moonbase, lin lunar, lunar update) but I couldn't get Gnome to compile completely. There were some broken dependencies with Gconf. I spent a couple of days on the forum looking for help and decided to try something else. I felt that if i knew a little more about Linux, then I would have been fine with this distro.

I did learn something that I found helpful and a little more familiar. I installed and configured XFree86, my mouse and then installed Xfce4 and Mozilla. These both compile pretty easily and allowed me to surf the user forums without having to reboot into Windows. I used this technique on every install afterward and suggest it to everyone when compiling a source-based distro.

I went to SourceMage 0.9.2. I had a few botched installs and then got a bootable Linux. However, I ran into trouble getting my nvidia drivers to work. The nvidia program was looking for kernel headers and the CD-Rom kernel didn't install them on my HDD. I checked the forum for this problem and there was a bug open, but I didn't know how to work the solution. There was also a broken depend on HD Parm. I had some more trouble with Gnome compiles being incomplete. There was one 'spell' that needed an extra line break at the end of the file , for it to compile correctly. I got Gnome up, but getting OpenOffice to install was real hard. After about a week, I moved on. Once again, my lack of Linux skill hampered me. The installation instructions are nearly identical to Lunar. In fact, by reading the two of them, I was able to get further along with both installations. I did manage to get the nifty little audio program to work and every time I successfully compiled something, Captain Kirk told me how happy he was. That broke up the install monotony and made me laugh every time. Still, I wanted more.

My third stop for compiling from scratch was Gentoo 2004.0. Their installation document was DETAILED!!! It covered everything. I got frustrated when I installed everything exactly as they mentioned - but I couldn't boot into Linux. I did it over and over until I found the problem - Gentoo's instructions lead with Grub as a bootloader and I was dual-booting with my Linux partitions on the second hard drive. Only by researching Grub, did I find that it only wants to be on the first hard drive. This detail wasn't in the Gentoo installation documents. (I hope that they put it in for rookies like me.)

I reinstalled, this time with Lilo and voila! I was in Linux. Gentoo has other documents for Desktop Configuration, Printing, Alsa and more. I do recommend reading the documents on Portage, USE=options, rc-update, Alsa and more. I made a mistake that forced me (because of not knowing any alternative) to rebuild. However, since I learned the Lilo v. Grub trick, it has been smooth sailing.

I have installed Gnome, KDE, AfterStep, Xfce, Xsane, Evolution, Mozilla, Setiapplet, Gimp - all without fail. ConclusionMy graphics are faster. I'm still playing with AGP options to see where I'm most satisfied. I've got some games programs to install, but Gentoo has a forum devoted to games, so I am sure that I'll be OK.

My choice is Gentoo because I got it to work.

I really wanted SourceMage and Lunar to work, but I just needed a little more help at install. Gentoo provided that and outside of the Grub issue, I will bet that anyone who follows the Gentoo instructions will be able to get a Gentoo Linux up and running. I'm really happy with the results. I feel a great sense of accomplishment by compiling my own Linux, from source, just the way I want it. I learned more about Linux and I haven't booted into Windows in 3 months.

Arvan Reese
Chicago, IL
man_exec@yahoo.com

[XiaoKJ]

Thats a bit too long, man_exec...

But its nice for anyone -- esp newbies to read!

Informational and very objective -- it has all the good advice any pro would give to a newbie -- you're great!

Congrats for your new gentoo system -- you can now help others without calling yourself newbie:D

(my $0.02)

[hard candy]

man_exec,
I suggest you copy and paste your post into "How I Did It" as a new thread, may help someone out someday. Especially the preparation parts. Was not too long for me.

[man_exec]

Originally posted by XiaoKJ
Thats a bit too long, man_exec...

But its nice for anyone -- esp newbies to read!

Informational and very objective -- it has all the good advice any pro would give to a newbie -- you're great!

Congrats for your new gentoo system -- you can now help others without calling yourself newbie:D

(my $0.02)

thanks for the two cents. :rolleyes:

I took the advice from hard candy and posted in 'how I did it'. Thanks also for being specific on how it read.

I'll see you around the forum, I'm sure.

[XiaoKJ]

For a link, I will try to link the three threads about linux together on this thread.

They are "Gentoo Ownz..." at:
http://www.justlinux.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=127084

and "Give Gentoo a Try!" which is very informational at:
http://www.justlinux.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=123442

[JohnT]

Originally posted by XiaoKJ
For a link, I will try to link the three threads about linux together on this thread.

They are "Gentoo Ownz..." at:
http://www.justlinux.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=127084

and "Give Gentoo a Try!" which is very informational at:
http://www.justlinux.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=123442 U-m-m-m...I think there are a few more than "THREE" threads about Linux......you have full-time job of linking ahead of you. No over-time pay. :D

[XiaoKJ]

Originally posted by JohnT
U-m-m-m...I think there are a few more than "THREE" threads about Linux......you have full-time job of linking ahead of you. No over-time pay. :D

Sorrie, I meant Gentoo threads, not linux...

My mistake...

BTW, those three threads I got to ever know(ended up in the hottest list) are filled with sarcasm, but if you really calm down to read it you will get something out of the mess. Its informational.

[JohnT]

Originally posted by XiaoKJ
Sorrie, I meant Gentoo threads, not linux...

My mistake...

BTW, those three threads I got to ever know(ended up in the hottest list) are filled with sarcasm, but if you really calm down to read it you will get something out of the mess. Its informational. Man if I calm down anymore your gonna put me to sleep:p Droning on and on about Gentoo.....its become a background white noise for me to snooze by.:rolleyes:

[chesskidd]

The first time that I've ever heard of "Gentoo", it drew an image of "tampon" product in my mind :rolleyes: , even the graphic looks like that way :( . Eh sorry to gentoo fans, but couldn't help stop thinking of it that way even today :D. Imagine that for people don't know much about linux world or its vast distros, and if they asked, my answer would always somehow sound awkward like "it's gentoo that I'm using", they'd probably think ...~wtf... something wrong with this guy~ :rolleyes: (maybe it's just less awkward in putting myself in a weird situation by answering straight forth: "linux")
I used to go for brand names like Red Hat, Mandrake, Slack, SUN...some sorts, which I was mainly drawn by those elegance, yeah these names used to shine my days. :D

Regardless of that, phew...I was totally wrong, distro names mean little, I realized behind that cloud it's a very good and robust distro, the only thing that I complain is its naming convention :D