Longhorn's 3d UI? I don't get it.

[hop-frog]

If you haven't already seen this, you can see clips of the new 3d UI being developed in Longhorn here:
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,1072789,00.asp

Is it just me or is this really stupid?

Why should my windows become distorted when I move them? Why would I want to watch Star Wars while it is spinning around like that?

[El_Cu_Guy]

Is it just me or was I the only one to hear the lady state that these were conceptuals and things that were possible?

Microsoft is appears to be taking a que from video game console demos. Sony, Nintendo, and MS all showed impressive demos but you don't see any XBOX games about ping-pong balls and mouse traps now do you?

These movies show possibilities as to what can be done. Take for example the Star Wars clip. Might someone create screensaver in which the user selects a video clip to use as a screensaver with those effects? Perhaps this same SS has an option to scan the DVD ROM drive and play a movie with all those same effects.

Maybe you're watching a movie using MediaPlayer. You pause it and a screensaver activates so the image doesn't burn into your monitor. It might add effects to the still or to say the last 30 seconds looped.

If anyone is planning to create such a "toy" go right ahead (or improve an exisiting one), I can't stop you. Perhaps you could beat MS to the punch. However, if you're the first I would at least appreciate a credit (see profile). You know something like conceptuals by...or something similar.

[Sepero]

You're right, it really does look stupid.

I can't believe some parts of the military use computers with this garbage on them.

Spinning and flipping windows? wtf? I guess Microsoft ran out of ideas to steal when people started licensing their software under GNU. hehehe :cool:

[El_Cu_Guy]

I can't believe some parts of the military use computers with this garbage on them.

The military is using Longhorn? No way. That's amazing considering it's not out yet.

I guess Microsoft ran out of ideas to steal when people started licensing their software under GNU. hehehe

This makes no sense. It only makes sense if everything else was public domain or cross licensed between MS and a third party.

You guys are obviously over reacting about something you obviously don't understand.

This stuff is conceptual. It's stuff that possible. It doesn't mean these effects will be defaults. They can be turned off. So Microsoft's graphical requirements for Longhorn only apply to those who want to turn all these effects on. I expect that people will be interested in this stuff and expect a new TweakUI or Plus! pack.

It's not like people are going to run Longhorn for the first time and find windows, the taskbar floating widely across the screen with movies spiraling in and out.

[Sepero]

El_Cu_Guy, you're an idiot.

I was going to make a come back to what you said, but you're not even worth the time. Thanks for the laugh though, you're a good joke. :D

[bazoukas]

Originally posted by Sepero
El_Cu_Guy, you're an idiot.

I was going to make a come back to what you said, but you're not even worth the time. Thanks for the laugh though, you're a good joke. :D

And your reply was so,,,,,,,out of bounce....i cant even make my self laugh.

[Seph64]

Originally posted by Sepero
El_Cu_Guy, you're an idiot.

I was going to make a come back to what you said, but you're not even worth the time. Thanks for the laugh though, you're a good joke. :D

And you sound like a regular einstein[/end sarcasm]

I thought this as a community, not a basis for someone to flame someone else. If you disagree with him, fine, but why insult him for something stated on the internet?

His reply to your "Military uses Windows" comment was a joke. How can I tell? Some of the words he put into that response.

I hope your atitude clears up. I'd hate it if you can just call someone an idiot over a trivial disagreement on the internet.

As to the UI effects in Windows Longhorn; I don't need them, I just want to use my computer, I do not want to be dazzled by neat effects that only the average computer user (people who don't rely on computers for all their entertainment) would like.

[retoon]

You guys are obviously over reacting about something you obviously don't understand.
Yeah, I agree with Seph64, that kind of attitude has to end.:)

[hop-frog]

El_Cu_Guy,
Okay, I'll buy that. I didn't realize Microsoft put on these little demonstrations just for fun. I thought that if they are going to show parts of their new OS off they would be showing some of the real features of it that people can look forward to. I figured that they were going to make it so that the windows rippled when you moved them (first video) and that they would slowly drift around like they were in outerspace (second video). From what the author said about it, I knew the third video was there just for fun.

[El_Cu_Guy]

I figured that they were going to make it so that the windows rippled when you moved them

Sure, why not? However, it's more likely this will be something that shows up in a Plus! packages rather than enabled by default.

and that they would slowly drift around like they were in outerspace

Eye candy. Nothing more.

From what the author said about it, I knew the third video was there just for fun.

I'd still like to see someone work this into a screensaver.

I thought that if they are going to show parts of their new OS off they would be showing some of the real features of it that people can look forward to.

The demonstartion was to show off the new GUI nothing more. However, I think there was probably more to it than just those videos.

[Parcival]

This videos are new to me, but the concept of MS going 3D with their desktop isn't. back in 2001 when I worked at a usability consultant's I got to see an MS promotion video for a 3D desktop that looked liked a room (e.g. an office). Programs, files, etc could all be "dropped" somewhere in this environment. Multiple desktops as we know them in Linux could be hung onto the walls of the room with the idea that when you need a different work environment, you take the specific "picture" from the wall.

I don't know what happened to that project. MS usability engineers claimed that a 3D desktop is better than 2D because it's a closer match to our daily 3D environment. Obviously MS has chosen to stay on the 3D track, even if it's just for the matter of eyecandy. I doubt if a 3D desktop really has that many advantages - a lot of Windows users are already having a hard time with the 2D desktop, so why should they be able to navigate the 3D desktop better when it's even more complex?

[El_Cu_Guy]

Most of the R&D for those types of projects was moved to Microsoft Research. If you're relly interested you could always do a search for TaskGallery.

I'm not really sure exactly what project you are referring to. Hell it could be Microsoft BOB for all I know.

Of course this isn't the best time for me to be trying to remember. Can't sleep. Plus I'm pissed because my deposit still hasn't shown up in my account (friggin holidays).

[Parcival]

El Cu Guy, you scored 100 points. Task gallery is the name of the project I couldn't remember. I found a description at
Microsoft Research (http://research.microsoft.com/ui/TaskGallery/index.htm).

I just hope this will never arrive in our WMs...:rolleyes:

[retoon]

You know what? I can't believe Im about to say this, but I think the Task Gallery is a good idea. I know that techies won't like it for its lag, but the concept is pretty cool. I would like to see something like that in the linux world. Please, no flaming. I don't like MS, or its business practices, I am just appreciating the concept of a 3D user interface. I think its cool.:confused: :eek: :p

[MxCl]

They're just copying OSX, OSX has supported transparency and neat 3D accelerated effects for a while now. Quartz Extreme is where it's at.

Admitedly OSX doesn't have spinning cubes and whatnot but that's probably because, as said, you couldn't make a user interface out of spinning cubes.

If you haven't played with a Quartz Extreme copy of OSX you really should, the UI is great fun, and there's something comforting about opening a terminal and typing ps -A or ls -la etc.. ;)

[bwkaz]

Originally posted by MxCl
Admitedly OSX doesn't have spinning cubes and whatnot but that's probably because, as said, you couldn't make a user interface out of spinning cubes. You know, it's funny. Microsoft can copy interface ideas from the Mac for all eternity (having 3D elements in the GUI), but they'll still manage to screw it up (you're right, you simply can't make a UI out of spinning cubes).

Heck, they can copy them from Xerox/PARC for all eternity, too, like they did for Windows 1.0 (and like Apple did with the early Macs), and still manage to screw them up.

Some things just never change, I guess...

[El_Cu_Guy]

Heck, they can copy them from Xerox/PARC for all eternity, too, like they did for Windows 1.0

Oh, no, no, no, no.....

Microsoft copied basic elements from Apple. Windows 1.0 wasn't even an OS. It was an application suite for DOS.

(and like Apple did with the early Macs)

Oh man. Time for yet another history lesson.

First off you must know that Douglas Engelbart was known for many things like inventing the first mouse. He was also know for taking many rough concepts and creating one of the first and impressive (yet extremely basic) working GUIs. There are concepts and works that predate his and all were demonstrated or released into the public domain (yes the PD).

Other Engelbart tidbits:

#Pioneering distributed electronic mail and e-mail lists five and seven years before ARPAnet.
#Implementing word processing a decade before it began to appear in offices.
#Designing the mouse as an input device sixteen years before Apple introduced it to the world.
#Creating a windowing environment twenty years before Microsoft.
#Envisioning hypertext-linked documents in a distributed environment a quarter-century before the World Wide Web.

Engelbart would later go on to work at PARC.

Ok let's start. Click here for a history lesson. (http://mackido.com/Interface/ui_history.html)

You can also go here (http://www.smalltalk.org/alankay.html)

Why people insist upon continuing to spread this TALL TALE I'll never know.

[proffy]

Originally posted by MxCl
They're just copying OSX, OSX has supported transparency and neat 3D accelerated effects for a while now. Quartz Extreme is where it's at.
Actually some people think Apple copied Microsoft on this one. MS unveiled chrome effects in 1998:
Windows product manager Brad Chase demonstrated Chromeffects most impressively during the Windows 98 launch on June 25. There, he showed four web pages, seen in perspective, overlapped and partially transparent. When a document was clicked on, it became solid, zoomed and rotated to fill the screen. Chase explained that eye-popping visuals such as 3-D zooms, ripple and shatter effects were just part of Chromeffect's arsenal of client-side, processor hungry effects. It's worth mentioning that, although Microsoft calls a 300 MHz Pentium II the minimum requirement, we were able to run the demos with only minor slowdowns on a PII/233 with 64MB RAM and a 4MB AGP card

from http://thetechnozone.com/the3Dzone/news/3d-chrome.html and http://thetechnozone.com/pcbuyersguide/software/programming/graphics-APIs.html

Microsoft decided not to put all these fancy effects because of the expensive hardware requirments. (As a side note, I belive some, or many on the chrome team left to form Wild Tangent (http://www.wildtangent.com) ) Now, with OEMS shipping their PCs with GeForce4's and ATI cards, it make sense to revive their "Chrome Effects".

Proffy

[proffy]

Originally posted by Sepero
I can't believe some parts of the military use computers with this garbage on them. The military does not use Alpha versions of OSes, that are still 2 years away from release.

Spinning and flipping windows? wtf? I guess Microsoft ran out of ideas to steal when people started licensing their software under GNU. hehehe :cool: Don't worry, you won't be left out. KDE and GNOME will copy Microsoft soon enough, just like they have in the past.

Proffy

[MxCl]

Originally posted by proffy
Don't worry, you won't be left out. KDE and GNOME will copy Microsoft soon enough, just like they have in the past.Heh, it's true, we do copy a lot of features. But mostly we improve them too so its not all plagarism at least.